[#11822] RCR: Input XML support in the base Ruby — Dave Thomas <Dave@...>

15 messages 2001/03/01

[#11960] Not Ruby, for me, for the moment at least — "Michael Kreuzer" <mkreuzer@... (nospam)>

I wrote on this newsgroup last weekend about how I was considering using

11 messages 2001/03/04

[#12023] French RUG ? — "Jerome" <jeromg@...>

Hi fellow rubyers,

16 messages 2001/03/05

[#12103] disassembling and reassembling a hash — raja@... (Raja S.)

Given a hash, h1, will the following always hold?

20 messages 2001/03/06

[#12204] FEATURE REQUEST: 'my' local variables — Leo Razoumov <see_signature@127.0.0.1>

Ruby is, indeed, a very well designed language.

64 messages 2001/03/07
[#12250] Re: FEATURE REQUEST: 'my' local variables — Leo Razoumov <see_signature@127.0.0.1> 2001/03/07

>>>>> "GK" == GOTO Kentaro <gotoken@math.sci.hokudai.ac.jp> writes:

[#12284] Re: FEATURE REQUEST: 'my' local variables — gotoken@... (GOTO Kentaro) 2001/03/08

In message "[ruby-talk:12250] Re: FEATURE REQUEST: 'my' local variables"

[#12289] Re: FEATURE REQUEST: 'my' local variables — matz@... (Yukihiro Matsumoto) 2001/03/08

Hi,

[#12452] Re: FEATURE REQUEST: 'my' local variables — gotoken@... (GOTO Kentaro) 2001/03/12

In message "[ruby-talk:12289] Re: FEATURE REQUEST: 'my' local variables"

[#12553] Re: FEATURE REQUEST: 'my' local variables — Dave Thomas <Dave@...> 2001/03/13

matz@zetabits.com (Yukihiro Matsumoto) writes:

[#12329] Math package — Mathieu Bouchard <matju@...>

18 messages 2001/03/09

[#12330] Haskell goodies, RCR and challenge — Robert Feldt <feldt@...>

Hi,

19 messages 2001/03/09
[#12374] Re: Haskell goodies, RCR and challenge — matz@... (Yukihiro Matsumoto) 2001/03/10

Hi,

[#12349] Can Ruby-GTK display Gif Png or Jpeg files? — Phlip <phlip_cpp@...>

Ruby-san:

20 messages 2001/03/09

[#12444] class variables — Max Ischenko <max@...>

14 messages 2001/03/12

[#12606] Order, chaos, and change requests :) — Dave Thomas <Dave@...>

17 messages 2001/03/14

[#12635] email address regexp — "David Fung" <dfung@...>

i would like to locate probable email addresses in a bunch of text files,

12 messages 2001/03/14

[#12646] police warns you -- Perl is dangerous!! — Leo Razoumov <see_signature@127.0.0.1>

I just read this story on Slashdot

14 messages 2001/03/14
[#12651] Re: police warns you -- Perl is dangerous!! — pete@... (Pete Kernan) 2001/03/14

On 14 Mar 2001 11:46:35 -0800, Leo Razoumov <see_signature@127.0.0.1> wrote:

[#12691] Re: police warns you -- Perl is dangerous!! — "W. Kent Starr" <elderburn@...> 2001/03/15

On Wednesday 14 March 2001 15:40, Pete Kernan wrote:

[#12709] [OFFTOPIC] Re: police warns you -- Perl is dangerous!! — Stephen White <spwhite@...> 2001/03/16

On Fri, 16 Mar 2001, W. Kent Starr wrote:

[#12655] Re: FEATURE REQUEST: 'my' local variables — "Benjamin J. Tilly" <ben_tilly@...>

>===== Original Message From Leo Razoumov <see_signature@127.0.0.1> =====

18 messages 2001/03/14

[#12706] Library packaging — "Nathaniel Talbott" <ntalbott@...>

I have a project that I'm working on that needs to live two different lives,

30 messages 2001/03/16

[#12840] Looking for a decent compression scheme — Dave Thomas <Dave@...>

14 messages 2001/03/19

[#12895] differences between range and array — "Doug Edmunds" <dae_alt3@...>

This code comes from the online code examples for

16 messages 2001/03/20
[#12896] Re: differences between range and array — "Hee-Sob Park" <phasis@...> 2001/03/20

[#12899] Re: differences between range and array — Jim Freeze <jim@...> 2001/03/20

On Tue, 20 Mar 2001, Hee-Sob Park wrote:

[#12960] TextBox ListBox — Ron Jeffries <ronjeffries@...>

Attached is a little Spike that Chet and I are doing. It is a

13 messages 2001/03/20

[#12991] [ANN] Lapidary 0.2.0 — "Nathaniel Talbott" <ntalbott@...>

Well, here's my first major contribution to the Ruby world: Lapidary. It's a

16 messages 2001/03/20

[#13028] mkmf question — Luigi Ballabio <luigi.ballabio@...>

15 messages 2001/03/21

[#13185] Reading a file backwards — "Daniel Berger" <djberg96@...>

Hi all,

21 messages 2001/03/25
[#13197] Re: Reading a file backwards — "Daniel Berger" <djberg96@...> 2001/03/25

> Hi Dan,

[#13203] Re: Reading a file backwards — Mathieu Bouchard <matju@...> 2001/03/25

On Sun, 25 Mar 2001, Daniel Berger wrote:

[#13210] Re: Reading a file backwards — "Daniel Berger" <djberg96@...> 2001/03/25

"Mathieu Bouchard" <matju@sympatico.ca> wrote in message

[#13374] Passing an array to `exec'? — Lloyd Zusman <ljz@...>

I'd like to do the following:

15 messages 2001/03/31

[#13397] Multidimensional arrays and hashes? — Lloyd Zusman <ljz@...>

Is it possible in ruby to make use of constructs that correspond to

14 messages 2001/03/31

[ruby-talk:13152] Re: gsub! & other in-place functions

From: "Brian Turner" <mrbrianturner502@...>
Date: 2001-03-23 18:40:02 UTC
List: ruby-talk #13152
I'm not sure I follow the logic that you need to know that something changed
when performing an operation. I think what you want is two things:

1. A method that might change the internal state of an object.
2. A method that reports on the internal state of the an object.

But to say you want both 1 and 2 is an operation that is not conceptually
crisp, or simple:

Perform operation and sometimes return something if the state of the object
changed, or nothing if the state is unchanged.

If I call some method, in any language, like unique, sort, reverse, I want
the operation performed. Whether it needed to be performed, or actually
changed anything is a different question, and therefore a different method.
If I want to know that something is already unique, already sorted, or that
the reverse ordering is the same as original, I would call methods like
isSorted, isUnique (or isSet), etc.

I personally found it confusing because the result of bang operations are
not consistent. And frankly, if bang operations are dangerous, having them
sometimes return nil, sometimes not, makes them even more dangerous!
Likewise, not consistently including the bang symbol is just as confusing.

I can understand and support the need to maintain methods for the sake of an
existing code base. But you shouldn't say that there are good design reasons
for inconsistent behaviour and labeling. The bang methods violate the
principle of least surprise (as described by Dave and Andy). Is there ever a
good reason to do this? I think there are excuses, but no reasons. I'd
rather hear the admission that yes, Ruby isn't perfect, it does have
inconsistencies, and these are some of them.

After all, Ruby _is_ a great language.

Being honest that it has some flaws is more useful than pretending that
every design choice that was made still makes complete sense just because
it's too hard to go back and change. The fact that it might be too hard to
go back change is all the reason you need. The other arguments, however,
seem weak, if not completely spurious.

Brian.






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