[#43299] Ruby implementation Q's — justinj@... (Justin Johnson)

Apologies in advance for this meaty posting:

30 messages 2002/07/01

[#43358] (0..3) == (0...4) returning false? — Massimiliano Mirra <list@...>

Is there a reason for two ranges holding the same extension but

41 messages 2002/07/02

[#43416] Segmentation Fault - Ruby Garbage Collection — James Eric Birmingham <avenger@...>

During load testing of our Ruby program, we have been getting

22 messages 2002/07/02

[#43570] self_parent — Tom Sawyer <transami@...>

i was wondering what others thought of the idea of having a built in

47 messages 2002/07/04
[#43571] Re: self_parent — David Alan Black <dblack@...> 2002/07/04

Hello --

[#43584] Re: self_parent — Tom Sawyer <transami@...> 2002/07/04

all my real examples are pretty large, mostly to do with using the REXML

[#43628] Re: self_parent — Massimiliano Mirra <list@...> 2002/07/05

On Fri, Jul 05, 2002 at 07:49:09AM +0900, Tom Sawyer wrote:

[#43662] Re: self_parent — Tom Sawyer <transami@...> 2002/07/05

On Fri, 2002-07-05 at 05:31, Massimiliano Mirra wrote:

[#43705] Re: self_parent — Austin Ziegler <austin@...> 2002/07/05

On Sat, 6 Jul 2002 03:32:11 +0900, Tom Sawyer wrote:

[#43713] Re: self_parent — Michael Campbell <michael_s_campbell@...> 2002/07/05

> In ten years of professional software development, a good chunk of

[#43602] is there a better string.each? — Tyler Spivey <tspivey8@...>

well, i have a bit of a problem:

98 messages 2002/07/05
[#43606] Re: is there a better string.each? — Tom Sawyer <transami@...> 2002/07/05

a = "canada"

[#43644] Re: is there a better string.each? — Sean Russell <ser@...> 2002/07/05

Tom Sawyer wrote:

[#43645] Re: is there a better string.each? — Michael Campbell <michael_s_campbell@...> 2002/07/05

> > thought it was strange myself. personally i'd like it if String

[#43707] Re: is there a better string.each? — Sean Russell <ser@...> 2002/07/05

Hal E. Fulton wrote:

[#43714] Re: is there a better string.each? — Michael Campbell <michael_s_campbell@...> 2002/07/05

[#43774] Re: is there a better string.each? — Sean Russell <ser@...> 2002/07/06

Michael Campbell wrote:

[#43805] Re: is there a better string.each? — Michael Campbell <michael_s_campbell@...> 2002/07/07

[#43848] Re: is there a better string.each? — "Hal E. Fulton" <hal9000@...> 2002/07/07

----- Original Message -----

[#43611] Powered by Ruby (logo) — Davey <davey@...>

Hey,

23 messages 2002/07/05

[#43780] passing to objects at the bottom — Tom Sawyer <transami@...>

i have a chain of objects such that one object contains another which

17 messages 2002/07/06

[#43795] Pre-RCR... nil.empty? — Dave Thomas <Dave@...>

34 messages 2002/07/07
[#43799] Re: Pre-RCR... nil.empty? — David Alan Black <dblack@...> 2002/07/07

Hi --

[#43807] unshifting a directory onto ENV['PATH'] — Bil Kleb <W.L.Kleb@...>

Is there a more elegant (compact?) method than

16 messages 2002/07/07

[#43916] How to determine EOF with sysread? — Jim Freeze <jim@...>

Hi:

13 messages 2002/07/08

[#43943] SV: SV: [ANN] Archive 0.2 — Thomas Søndergaard <tsondergaard@...>

DQo+IFRoYW5rcy4gOi0pIEknbSBub3QgdGVycmlibHkgaW4gaHVycnkgdG8gYWRkIFppcCBzdXBw

13 messages 2002/07/08

[#43944] Re: is there a better string.each? — George Ogata <g_ogata@...>

Hi,

45 messages 2002/07/08
[#43959] Re: is there a better string.each? — Austin Ziegler <austin@...> 2002/07/08

On Mon, 8 Jul 2002 20:43:57 +0900, George Ogata wrote:

[#43949] for ... else ... end — "Kontra, Gergely" <kgergely@...>

Hi!

45 messages 2002/07/08
[#44103] Re: for ... else ... end — Sean Russell <ser@...> 2002/07/09

Yukihiro Matsumoto wrote:

[#44107] Re: for ... else ... end — "Kontra, Gergely" <kgergely@...> 2002/07/09

For the keyword war: (silly, dummy example)

[#43957] Redirecting standard error — Gilles Filippini <gilles.filippini@...>

Hi,

13 messages 2002/07/08

[#44019] String#split converts string args to regexes -- ? — David Alan Black <dblack@...>

Hello --

41 messages 2002/07/08
[#44104] Re: String#split converts string args to regexes -- ? — kasal@... (Stepan Kasal) 2002/07/09

Hallo,

[#44137] Re: String#split converts string args to regexes -- ? — matz@... (Yukihiro Matsumoto) 2002/07/09

Hi,

[#44209] Re: String#split converts string args to regexes -- ? — kasal@... (Stepan Kasal) 2002/07/10

Hallo,

[#44212] Re: String#split converts string args to regexes -- ? — David Alan Black <dblack@...> 2002/07/10

Hi --

[#44265] spliter of for...each: looping — Tom Sawyer <transami@...>

when looping, using each, i find i am often wonton of a few nice

24 messages 2002/07/10
[#44266] Re: spliter of for...each: looping — David Alan Black <dblack@...> 2002/07/10

Hello --

[#44268] Re: spliter of for...each: looping — Tom Sawyer <transami@...> 2002/07/10

hmmm...

[#44270] Re: spliter of for...each: looping — David Alan Black <dblack@...> 2002/07/10

Hi --

[#44272] Re: spliter of for...each: looping — Tom Sawyer <transami@...> 2002/07/10

david,

[#44275] Re: spliter of for...each: looping — David Alan Black <dblack@...> 2002/07/10

Hi --

[#44282] Re: spliter of for...each: looping — Tom Sawyer <transami@...> 2002/07/11

each_with_nindex, rocking! i'll throw that in my library, for sure.

[#44289] Re: spliter of for...each: looping — David Alan Black <dblack@...> 2002/07/11

Hi --

[#44296] RE: Commercial Support for Ruby — "Berger, Daniel" <djberge@...>

> Hi Everyone,

18 messages 2002/07/11

[#44312] opengl — Tom Sawyer <transami@...>

can any one give me some help installing the opengl interface library? i

22 messages 2002/07/11
[#44316] Re: opengl — Dossy <dossy@...> 2002/07/11

On 2002.07.12, Tom Sawyer <transami@transami.net> wrote:

[#44320] Re: opengl — Tom Sawyer <transami@...> 2002/07/11

just did apt-get mesag-dev. still the same thing:

[#44387] Dynamic Methods — "John" <nojgoalbyspam@...>

Hi all,

29 messages 2002/07/12
[#44402] Re: Dynamic Methods — "John" <nojgoalbyspam@...> 2002/07/12

Wow! Thanks Dave!

[#44408] Re: Dynamic Methods — Michael Campbell <michael_s_campbell@...> 2002/07/12

[#44415] Re: Dynamic Methods — "John" <nojgoalbyspam@...> 2002/07/13

> (What do you propose if more than one possibility matches, by the

[#44425] hey! where's #count? — Tom Sawyer <transami@...>

i went to count the number of equal objects in an array and discoverd

24 messages 2002/07/13
[#44515] Re: hey! where's #count? — "Christoph" <chr_news@...> 2002/07/14

"Tom Sawyer" wrote

[#44516] Re: hey! where's #count? — Philipp Meier <meier@...> 2002/07/14

On Sun, Jul 14, 2002 at 11:41:55PM +0900, Christoph wrote:

[#44517] RE: hey! where's #count? — "Christoph" <crippel@...> 2002/07/14

[#44482] instance_eval — "John" <nojgoalbyspam@...>

Hi all,

14 messages 2002/07/13

[#44618] RE: TkText no -textvariable workaround? — "J.Hawkesworth" <J.Hawkesworth@...>

I think what Tom is after is a neat way to have the widget's display

41 messages 2002/07/16
[#44621] RE: TkText no -textvariable workaround? — Tom Sawyer <transami@...> 2002/07/16

On Tue, 2002-07-16 at 09:08, J.Hawkesworth wrote:

[#44622] Re: TkText no -textvariable workaround? — Dossy <dossy@...> 2002/07/16

On 2002.07.17, Tom Sawyer <transami@transami.net> wrote:

[#44626] Re: TkText no -textvariable workaround? — Tom Sawyer <transami@...> 2002/07/16

actually, Dossy, your post was a bit helpful. what i'm after also sort

[#44628] Re: TkText no -textvariable workaround? — Dossy <dossy@...> 2002/07/16

On 2002.07.17, Tom Sawyer <transami@transami.net> wrote:

[#44734] Syntax "surprise" — "David Douthitt" <DDouthitt@...>

I don't know if this qualifies as a real "surprise", but it was to me. I h=

39 messages 2002/07/17

[#44788] Selling ruby to my boss — Francis Hwang <sera@...>

So I've just started working as the sole programmer at a non-profit

22 messages 2002/07/18

[#44829] Q: "print usage_msg, exit 1 if error_flag" does not work — kwatch@... (kwatch)

Hi,

15 messages 2002/07/18
[#44831] Re: Q: "print usage_msg, exit 1 if error_flag" does not work — ts <decoux@...> 2002/07/18

>>>>> "k" == kwatch <kwatch@lycos.jp> writes:

[#44832] Re: Q: "print usage_msg, exit 1 if error_flag" does not work — Hugh Sasse Staff Elec Eng <hgs@...> 2002/07/18

On Thu, 18 Jul 2002, ts wrote:

[#44833] Re: Q: "print usage_msg, exit 1 if error_flag" does not work — ts <decoux@...> 2002/07/18

>>>>> "H" == Hugh Sasse Staff Elec Eng <hgs@dmu.ac.uk> writes:

[#44855] Ruby in MacOSX 10.2 (Jaguar) — Luc Heinrich <lucsky@...>

It now seems to be "official" that Ruby will come by default with the next iteration of MacOSX.

12 messages 2002/07/18

[#44893] amrita 0.8.1 — Taku Nakajima <tnakajima@...>

Amrita is a a html/xhtml template library for Ruby.

22 messages 2002/07/19

[#44920] Objective C backend for Ruby? — "James F.Hranicky" <jfh@...>

While people are kicking around ideas for new backends for Ruby,

24 messages 2002/07/19

[#44985] GUI's and the Rouge, Part II — Tom Sawyer <transami@...>

in part one of this message i mention the problem of non-POLS and

72 messages 2002/07/20
[#45161] Re: GUI's and the Rouge, Part II — patrick-may@... (Patrick May) 2002/07/23

Ned Konz <ned@bike-nomad.com> wrote in message news:<200207201125.13528@ned.bike-nomad.com>...

[#45241] Re: GUI's and the Rouge, Part III (yes, finally) 1/2 — Tom Sawyer <transami@...> 2002/07/23

a bit of an intro: my original thought on the matter of making a

[#45246] Re: GUI's and the Rouge, Part III (yes, finally) 1/2 — Albert Wagner <alwagner@...> 2002/07/24

Still looks like plain old Model-View-Controller to me. You've split the

[#45282] RE: GUI's and the Rouge, Part III (yes, finally) 1/2 — "Curt Hibbs" <curt@...> 2002/07/24

Tom Sawyer wrote:

[#45287] RE: GUI's and the Rouge, Part III (yes, finally) 1/2 — Steve Tuckner <STUCKNER@...> 2002/07/24

What about WX-Windows. There is no ruby bindings for it, but would that fit

[#45300] RE: GUI's and the Rouge, Part III (yes, finally) 1/2 — Tom Sawyer <transami@...> 2002/07/24

On Wed, 2002-07-24 at 08:39, Steve Tuckner wrote:

[#45314] Re: GUI's and the Rouge, Part III (yes, finally) 1/2 — Wayne Vucenic <wvucenic@...> 2002/07/24

Hi Tom,

[#45364] RE: GUI's and the Rouge, Part III (yes, finally) 1/2 — "Curt Hibbs" <curt@...> 2002/07/25

Wayne Vucenic wrote:

[#45416] wxWindows for ruby — "repeater" <repeater@...> 2002/07/25

> Wayne Vucenic wrote:

[#44994] Learning Japanese — "John" <nojgoalbyspam@...>

Inspired to learn to read Japanese due to a lot of information on Ruby being

12 messages 2002/07/20

[#45044] Install troubles — Jim Freeze <jfreeze@...>

Hi:

13 messages 2002/07/21
[#45051] Re: Install troubles — Chris Gehlker <gehlker@...> 2002/07/21

On 7/21/02 12:13 PM, "Jim Freeze" <jfreeze@freebsdportal.com> wrote:

[#45085] ruby-dev summary 17696-17713 — Minero Aoki <aamine@...>

Hi all,

28 messages 2002/07/22
[#45090] rdtool and rdoc — Dave Thomas <Dave@...> 2002/07/22

Minero Aoki <aamine@mx.edit.ne.jp> writes:

[#45118] Re: rdtool and rdoc — "David Douthitt" <DDouthitt@...>

I took a look at your comparison page. I've not used either, but some thin=

16 messages 2002/07/22

[#45136] Strings and member-operators — the Bare <grrr@...>

Hi:

22 messages 2002/07/22
[#45140] Re: Strings and member-operators — Dossy <dossy@...> 2002/07/23

On 2002.07.23, the Bare <grrr@wild.net> wrote:

[#45148] Re: Strings and member-operators — David Alan Black <dblack@...> 2002/07/23

Hi --

[#45173] Re: Strings and member-operators — Dossy <dossy@...> 2002/07/23

On 2002.07.23, David Alan Black <dblack@candle.superlink.net> wrote:

[#45175] Re: Strings and member-operators — David Alan Black <dblack@...> 2002/07/23

Hi --

[#45198] Re: Strings and member-operators — George Ogata <g_ogata@...> 2002/07/23

Hello,

[#45201] Re: Strings and member-operators — David Alan Black <dblack@...> 2002/07/23

Hi --

[#45206] Re: Strings and member-operators — Tom Sawyer <transami@...> 2002/07/23

let me get this straight? is the original question how to strip a string

[#45257] Re: GUI's and the Rouge, Part III (yes, finally) 1/2 — Benjamin Peterson <bjsp123@...>

>you have this super application you wrote --the

11 messages 2002/07/24

[#45269] Can I get data back from a fork? — Jim Freeze <jfreeze@...>

Hi:

15 messages 2002/07/24

[#45286] Re: GUI's and the Rouge, Part III (yes, finally) 1/2 — Benjamin Peterson <bjsp123@...>

>its really just SOC on aanother level.

10 messages 2002/07/24

[#45368] Re: [OT] Re: GUI's and the Rouge, Part III (yes, finally) 1/2 — Benjamin Peterson <bjsp123@...>

>The functionality of a spreadsheet had been around

39 messages 2002/07/25
[#45476] Re: curses dev kit, was Re: [OT] Re: GUI's and the Rouge — Thomas Dickey <dickey@...> 2002/07/26

clemens fischer <ino-waiting@gmx.net> wrote:

[#45480] Re: curses dev kit, was Re: [OT] Re: GUI's and the Rouge — Massimiliano Mirra <list@...> 2002/07/26

On Fri, Jul 26, 2002 at 07:51:25PM +0900, Thomas Dickey wrote:

[#45422] Singleton Classes & thread safety — David King Landrith <dave@...>

I'm a bit new to Ruby, so please excuse me if this is a simplistic=20

24 messages 2002/07/25
[#45425] Re: Singleton Classes & thread safety — Ned Konz <ned@...> 2002/07/25

On Thursday 25 July 2002 02:06 pm, David King Landrith wrote:

[#45427] Re: Singleton Classes & thread safety — David King Landrith <dave@...> 2002/07/25

On Thursday, July 25, 2002, at 05:26 PM, Ned Konz wrote:

[#45430] Re: Singleton Classes & thread safety — Ned Konz <ned@...> 2002/07/25

On Thursday 25 July 2002 02:44 pm, David King Landrith wrote:

[#45431] How do you think of... — Michael Campbell <michael_s_campbell@...> 2002/07/25

This is going to sound like an odd question, and there's no "right"

[#45429] Opinion on Ruby maturity, the missing things — "Paul E.C. Melis" <paul@...>

Hello all,

18 messages 2002/07/25
[#45440] Re: Opinion on Ruby maturity, the missing things — John Carter <john.carter@...> 2002/07/25

On Fri, 26 Jul 2002, Paul E.C. Melis wrote:

[#45465] Ruby-Talk Index — Tom Sawyer <transami@...>

here's a one nighter coding challange for some one feeling the need to

17 messages 2002/07/26
[#45466] Re: Ruby-Talk Index — matz@... (Yukihiro Matsumoto) 2002/07/26

Hi,

[#45467] Re: Ruby-Talk Index — Tom Sawyer <transami@...> 2002/07/26

On Thu, 2002-07-25 at 23:50, Yukihiro Matsumoto wrote:

[#45621] Seattle.rb meeting tomorrow (7/30) — Pat Eyler <pate@...>

Just a quick reminder that we'll be meeting tomorrow night at 7:00 PM at

11 messages 2002/07/29

[#45644] FormatR 1.06 — Paul Rubel <rubel@...>

A new release of FormatR is out, 1.06. FormatR provides perl-like

37 messages 2002/07/30

[#45688] Ruby Language Q's — "Justin Johnson" <justinj@...>

76 messages 2002/07/30
[#45689] Re: Ruby Language Q's — Dave Thomas <Dave@...> 2002/07/30

"Justin Johnson" <justinj@mobiusent.com> writes:

[#45690] Re: Ruby Language Q's — ts <decoux@...> 2002/07/30

>>>>> "D" == Dave Thomas <Dave@PragmaticProgrammer.com> writes:

[#45723] Syntax proposal — Massimiliano Mirra <list@...>

I often write things like this:

12 messages 2002/07/30

[#45737] ActiveRubyScript and RubyAEOSA — Chris Gehlker <gehlker@...>

I just discovered ActiveRubyScript (sometimes written as two words) by

14 messages 2002/07/30
[#45742] Re: ActiveRubyScript and RubyAEOSA — "Hal E. Fulton" <hal9000@...> 2002/07/30

----- Original Message -----

[#45768] RE: A very basic tail -f implementation — "Berger, Daniel" <djberge@...>

> From: Paul Brannan [mailto:pbrannan@atdesk.com]

12 messages 2002/07/30

[#45799] Question about GetoptLong — Patrick Bennett <patrick.bennett@...>

I'm trying to recreate a Perl script in Ruby and have run into a problem.

22 messages 2002/07/31

[#45829] Unicode in Ruby now? — Tobias Peters <tpeters@...>

I've read the thread "Unicode in Ruby's Future?" [ruby-talk: 40016]. It

52 messages 2002/07/31
[#45840] Re: Unicode in Ruby now? — matz@... (Yukihiro Matsumoto) 2002/07/31

Hi,

[#45954] Re: Unicode in Ruby now? — Tobias Peters <tpeters@...> 2002/08/01

On Wed, 31 Jul 2002, Yukihiro Matsumoto wrote:

[#45960] Re: Unicode in Ruby now? — Curt Sampson <cjs@...> 2002/08/01

On Thu, 1 Aug 2002, Tobias Peters wrote:

[#45969] Re: Unicode in Ruby now? — Alexander Bokovoy <a.bokovoy@...> 2002/08/01

On Thu, Aug 01, 2002 at 07:53:07PM +0900, Curt Sampson wrote:

[#45973] Re: Unicode in Ruby now? — Curt Sampson <cjs@...> 2002/08/01

On Thu, 1 Aug 2002, Alexander Bokovoy wrote:

[#45979] Re: Unicode in Ruby now? — Alexander Bokovoy <a.bokovoy@...> 2002/08/01

On Thu, Aug 01, 2002 at 09:55:48PM +0900, Curt Sampson wrote:

[#45982] Re: Unicode in Ruby now? — Curt Sampson <cjs@...> 2002/08/01

On Thu, 1 Aug 2002, Alexander Bokovoy wrote:

[#45993] Re: Unicode in Ruby now? — Alexander Bokovoy <a.bokovoy@...> 2002/08/01

On Thu, Aug 01, 2002 at 11:23:38PM +0900, Curt Sampson wrote:

[#46042] Re: Unicode in Ruby now? — Curt Sampson <cjs@...> 2002/08/02

On Fri, 2 Aug 2002, Alexander Bokovoy wrote:

[#46260] Re: Unicode in Ruby now? — Clifford Heath <cjh_nospam@...> 2002/08/04

Curt Sampson wrote:

[#46266] Re: Unicode in Ruby now? — Curt Sampson <cjs@...> 2002/08/05

On Mon, 5 Aug 2002, Clifford Heath wrote:

[#46281] Re: Unicode in Ruby now? — Clifford Heath <cjh_nospam@...> 2002/08/05

Curt Sampson wrote:

[#45922] Re: Unicode in Ruby now? — Clifford Heath <cjh_nospam@...> 2002/08/01

Matz,

[#45931] Re: Unicode in Ruby now? — Curt Sampson <cjs@...> 2002/08/01

On Thu, 1 Aug 2002, Clifford Heath wrote:

[#45859] matrix challange — Daniel Bretoi <lists@...>

15 messages 2002/07/31

[#45876] Emacs is dead, long live whatever comes after that as long as it is made with Ruby — Jani Alanko <jani.alanko@...>

Subject is not exactly right but I was too lazy to invent something that

13 messages 2002/07/31

Ruby and Ocaml - my two favorite languages

From: "MikkelFJ" <mikkelfj-anti-spam@...>
Date: 2002-07-31 00:57:27 UTC
List: ruby-talk #45787
While being away from Ruby land, I did investigate the OCaml language
further.

I've earlier posted some information on OCaml in this group when I was just
starting to look at the OCaml language. This is a follow up after I have
gaining more experience.

I can now confidently say that Ruby and OCaml are at the absolute top of
programming languages. I'm a bit annoyed with the fact the OCaml is in fact
so good the it steals ground from Ruby. Its a bit like a Japanese
sportsmotorcycle compared to a European ditto with the nationalities
reversed.

OCaml with static linking with C object files is better suited for large
system applications than Ruby both becuase its faster and due to
distribution of runtime as exe rather than clear source files. What really
surprised me was that OCaml actually competeded with Ruby in the discipline
of rapid prototyping and still managed to produce better code than carefully
developed C++ code requiring significantly more development time.

Still many bright things are happening for Ruby and I am certainly not going
to dismiss Ruby.
I'm looking forward to see Ruby increasingly involved in building the future
Web both via integration with Apache and the support of Web Services where
Google have been kind enough to be a Ruby front runner. And this is possible
the best recognition you can get, because I can't think of a greater
application the Google.

Ruby on the other hand is class example in OO development, but what is
really great OO or not, is that you can actually write modules of 2K size
that does meaningful things and plugs seamlessly into the development
environment.
Ruby initially impressed me with huge number of highly functional but
redicously small library implementations in native Ruby. I spend hours
searching for what the rest of the a database interface because it couldn't
possibly all be in those 2.5 K.

You can also write suprisingly short programs in OCaml, but overall there is
more fuzz with getting the source file dependencies right in the makefile
which also complicates integrating third party tools not in the standard
distribution.

While Ruby is a language with one of the easiest FFI's (foreign function
interface), it is actually easier in OCaml. In fact it is so easy that
provided you stick to certain datatypes, it can be almost be neglected
whether you write a function in C or OCaml: Instead of writing a C prototype
in a .h file, you write a similar line in OCaml and use it as if it was a
native OCaml function. Accesing OCaml in the C function requires a macro on
the argument to get the desired C type, not unlike Ruby. Callbacks the other
way around is also quite managable although not as trivial. I once looked at
an enormously complex JNI interface, only to discover that this was the new
greatly simplified JNI interface... go figure.

The OCaml syntax is not the best I've seen, so I tried to imagine all kinds
of improvements. However, once I got used to it, I still didn't quite fancy
it, but I was hard pressed coming up with anything better that would be
equally efficient. OCaml is as terse as is possible without becoming
entirely unreadable. I think you could actually mix some of Ruby's syntax
with OCamls functional concepts and get an even greater language. Must do so
one day :-)

It appears that you actually write shorter programs in OCaml than in Ruby,
however, you also maintain separate interface files for larger programs.

I wrote a Ruby hack to convert Yacc grammar file into a Visual Parse ditto.
This included lineparsing and grabbing a name, making it upper case and add
a counter for each alternative of the rule. Ruby is a natural for these
tasks. I started out doing a manual conversion, but halfway down realized it
was actually worthwhile to write a Rubyscript just to complete the other
half. And it actually was faster to write the Ruby program than the manual
conversion I did on the first half of the file.

Later I tried to write the same conversion in OCaml both to see how it would
work out, and also because I could then have an executable that did not
require Ruby to be installed. I turned out to be equally easy to write the
program in OCaml. Result was possibly slightly shorter. Execution time was
irrelevant but instant in both cases. The write code then run a test cycle
was very fast in both languages. OCaml has a toplevel interpreter that makes
it possible to execute code much like Ruby - but it still needs to link
libraries. For that purpose OCaml has a program that generates a new
toplevel interpreter linked with the libraries you specify. Once a new
toplevel with the necessary string library was created, the development
phase compared to Ruby. OCaml requires very frequent tests because it is
strongly type checked. Like Ruby you do not actually write the type because
it can figure it out. However, you do not want to write a bunch of code and
then figure out what you did wrong with a host of infered types being
something you cannot guess what is. Upside is that with early test this
works well and it did help me avoid some tricky bugs I made in the Ruby
version.

The slightly disappointing side of this is, from a Ruby perspective, is that
OCaml seems to be strong also in those areas where Ruby were supposed to be
uniquely strong. Still Ruby is the more natural, elegant and accessible
language.

Ruby has embedded regular expressions which is something OCaml does not have
directly but through a regex type. Next version of OCaml will include a
preprocessor extension that will directly inject regular expressions into
the language core, without doing anything to the core language. This change
will also make it possible to create entire lexers directly in the language.
The OCaml preprocessor is far from trivial to work with, but you can do some
amazing things with it.

While OCaml do have support for Objects and it does have some kind of
polymorphism, this is clearly an area where Ruby is better off thanks to the
dynamic typing. The price in Ruby is that you need more runtype type
checks - which is something you'd have to remember to do in order to avoid
runtime errors. But in the end you have to cover all possibilities somehow
in either language.

If I could I'd use Ruby as a scripting language for application automation
language and develop large applications in OCaml. With these two tools,
there is only low-level C programming left and little space left for C++
development. I can positively say that for certain types of applications
OCaml is 5 to 10 times faster to implement than C++ (for an experienced C++
developer and inexperienced OCaml developer) because I did prototype in
OCaml and subsequently implemented in C++. I've no reason to believe this is
different for Ruby, except Ruby doesn't link into executables which kind of
disqualified it for the purpose. Runtime wise I have no data, but I'm sure
the runtime is faster in OCaml than C++ due to reduced ability to retain
strong typing in C++ without using rather complex template programming. I
believe Ruby runtime would not have been significantly slower for the same
reason. Ruby deals with dynamic typing and handles memory management. Why is
it so much faster to write code in Ruby or OCaml? Fewer steps from concept
to implementation means less work resulting and fewer errors and faster
results increases motivation to see yet more results rather than falling
asleep over the debugger.

While I do envy the garbage collection of Java and C#, and possibly the
libraries, I still consider C++ a much more powerfull language but also much
more difficult and unnecessarily complex. You can then extrapolite this with
what what I wrote above. Obviously a global standard such as Java is worth
much, but the courage to go you own way has a value of its own. I do not
agree with all the Paul Graham writes, but after all it was in the NG I was
introduced to his article Beating the Averages.
http://www.paulgraham.com/avg.html
Which somehow makes me think of beating the top dog...

[after writing the above, I found the following article at Grahams site for
his new arc language:
http://www.paulgraham.com/vanlfsp.html it mentions OCaml as a langauge for
smart people and Java for the masses - your free to add Ruby to LFSM]


In conclusion: obviously there are many and many good languages around and
you can't say a language is the best for all purposes. But I've been
searching for a successor to C++ and came up with two languages worth
further investigation. So since you already know Ruby, I'd recommend you
also take a look at OCaml.
The very great and huge book developing applications with OCaml was recently
published in a preview english translation online:
http://www.ocaml.org/
http://caml.inria.fr/oreilly-book/

I feel it has been a long journey to find a new useful language, and I feel
compelled to to repeat Doug Baglays editorial because I tend to agree. Both
Ruby and OCaml gets good mention
http://www.bagley.org/~doug/shootout/editorial.shtml

But while Ruby and OCaml may be my favorite languages, it is only because C
for all its quirks has lifted itself out of the ordinary and become the
atmosphere that makes programming possible.

Finally, Ruby cannot too soon get better closure integration as first class
values and partial evaluation support. This is an absolute killer feature of
OCaml. Most of what Ruby does great is thanks to its use of closures and
most of what Ocaml does better is thanks to its improved use of closures.

Mikkel



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