[#5737] returning strings from methods/instance_methods — TRANS <transfire@...>

I was just wondering why with #methods and #instance_methods, it was

11 messages 2005/09/08

[#5796] proposed attr writer patch — Daniel Berger <Daniel.Berger@...>

Hi all,

18 messages 2005/09/16

[#5798] Makefile error in OpenSLL extension (on Windows) — noreply@...

Bugs item #2472, was opened at 2005-09-16 18:56

11 messages 2005/09/17
[#5800] Re: [ ruby-Bugs-2472 ] Makefile error in OpenSLL extension (on Windows) — nobu.nokada@... 2005/09/17

Hi,

[#5851] Re: RubyGems in Ruby HEAD — Paul van Tilburg <paul@...>

Hi all,

34 messages 2005/09/21
[#5867] Re: RubyGems in Ruby HEAD — mathew <meta@...> 2005/09/21

Paul van Tilburg wrote:

[#5870] Re: RubyGems in Ruby HEAD — Marc Dequènes (Duck) <Duck@...> 2005/09/21

[#5920] Re: RubyGems in Ruby HEAD — mathew <meta@...> 2005/09/22

Marc Dequ竪nes (Duck) wrote:

[#5926] Re: RubyGems in Ruby HEAD — Pascal Terjan <pterjan@...> 2005/09/23

On 9/22/05, mathew <meta@pobox.com> wrote:

[#5931] Re: RubyGems in Ruby HEAD — Austin Ziegler <halostatue@...> 2005/09/23

On 9/23/05, Pascal Terjan <pterjan@gmail.com> wrote:

[#5898] Delegate and Forwardable Documentation — James Edward Gray II <james@...>

I've tried to send these files through a couple of times now with

17 messages 2005/09/22
[#5911] Re: Delegate and Forwardable Documentation — James Edward Gray II <james@...> 2005/09/22

On Sep 22, 2005, at 9:02 AM, James Edward Gray II wrote:

[#5924] Re: Delegate and Forwardable Documentation — James Edward Gray II <james@...> 2005/09/23

On Sep 22, 2005, at 11:53 AM, James Edward Gray II wrote:

[#5941] Re: Delegate and Forwardable Documentation — Yukihiro Matsumoto <matz@...> 2005/09/23

Hi,

[#5942] Re: Delegate and Forwardable Documentation — James Edward Gray II <james@...> 2005/09/23

On Sep 23, 2005, at 10:54 AM, Yukihiro Matsumoto wrote:

[#5947] Re: Delegate and Forwardable Documentation — Yukihiro Matsumoto <matz@...> 2005/09/23

Hi,

[#5921] Mutually dependent libs double loading. — TRANS <transfire@...>

I'm on Ruby 1.8.2.

14 messages 2005/09/23
[#5923] Re: Mutually dependent libs double loading. — Florian Gro<florgro@...> 2005/09/23

TRANS wrote:

[#5985] Finally an answer to my RubyGems question and some small suggestions — TRANS <transfire@...>

I appreciate those that attempted to offer me some info on this issue.

9 messages 2005/09/26

[#6001] Require Namepaces and RubyGems' effect on LoadPath problem — TRANS <transfire@...>

I've added namespaces to require. Works like this:

94 messages 2005/09/26
[#6002] Re: Require Namepaces and RubyGems' effect on LoadPath problem — Austin Ziegler <halostatue@...> 2005/09/26

On 9/26/05, TRANS <transfire@gmail.com> wrote:

[#6003] Re: Require Namepaces and RubyGems' effect on LoadPath problem — TRANS <transfire@...> 2005/09/26

On 9/26/05, Austin Ziegler <halostatue@gmail.com> wrote:

[#6005] Re: Require Namepaces and RubyGems' effect on LoadPath problem — Austin Ziegler <halostatue@...> 2005/09/26

On 9/26/05, TRANS <transfire@gmail.com> wrote:

[#6007] gems is a language change, not a pkging system (Re: Require Namepaces and RubyGems' effect on LoadPath problem) — Sam Roberts <sroberts@...> 2005/09/26

Quoting halostatue@gmail.com, on Tue, Sep 27, 2005 at 06:02:07AM +0900:

[#6013] Re: gems is a language change, not a pkging system (Re: Require Namepaces and RubyGems' effect on LoadPath problem) — Austin Ziegler <halostatue@...> 2005/09/27

On 9/26/05, Sam Roberts <sroberts@uniserve.com> wrote:

[#6014] Re: gems is a language change, not a pkging system — Sam Roberts <sroberts@...> 2005/09/27

Quoting halostatue@gmail.com, on Tue, Sep 27, 2005 at 10:29:17AM +0900:

[#6015] Re: gems is a language change, not a pkging system — James Edward Gray II <james@...> 2005/09/27

On Sep 26, 2005, at 8:54 PM, Sam Roberts wrote:

[#6016] Re: gems is a language change, not a pkging system — Sam Roberts <sroberts@...> 2005/09/27

Quoting james@grayproductions.net, on Tue, Sep 27, 2005 at 11:06:01AM +0900:

[#6018] Re: gems is a language change, not a pkging system — Austin Ziegler <halostatue@...> 2005/09/27

On 9/26/05, Sam Roberts <sroberts@uniserve.com> wrote:

[#6019] Re: gems is a language change, not a pkging system — Sam Roberts <sroberts@...> 2005/09/27

Quoting halostatue@gmail.com, on Tue, Sep 27, 2005 at 11:49:14AM +0900:

[#6024] Re: gems is a language change, not a pkging system — Austin Ziegler <halostatue@...> 2005/09/27

On 9/27/05, Sam Roberts <sroberts@uniserve.com> wrote:

[#6025] Re: gems is a language change, not a pkging system — Ralph Amissah <ralph.amissah@...> 2005/09/27

> Right now, they're watching people who have pretty much sat on the side

[#6026] Re: gems is a language change, not a pkging system — Austin Ziegler <halostatue@...> 2005/09/27

On 9/27/05, Ralph Amissah <ralph.amissah@gmail.com> wrote:

[#6043] Re: gems is a language change, not a pkging system — Ralph Amissah <ralph.amissah@...> 2005/09/28

I'll greatly weaken my post, and give everyone the opportunity to head me

[#6044] Re: gems is a language change, not a pkging system — Hugh Sasse <hgs@...> 2005/09/28

On Wed, 28 Sep 2005, Ralph Amissah wrote:

[#6073] Re: gems is a language change, not a pkging system — Mauricio Fern疣dez <mfp@...> 2005/09/28

Hello,

[#6074] Re: gems is a language change, not a pkging system — Jim Weirich <jim@...> 2005/09/29

On Wednesday 28 September 2005 07:35 pm, Mauricio Fern疣dez wrote:

[#6017] Re: gems is a language change, not a pkging system — Austin Ziegler <halostatue@...> 2005/09/27

On 9/26/05, Sam Roberts <sroberts@uniserve.com> wrote:

[#6046] Re: gems is a language change, not a pkging system — "Sean E. Russell" <ser@...> 2005/09/28

On Monday 26 September 2005 22:41, Austin Ziegler wrote:

[#6050] Re: gems is a language change, not a pkging system — Hugh Sasse <hgs@...> 2005/09/28

On Wed, 28 Sep 2005, Sean E. Russell wrote:

[#6207] Re: gems is a language change, not a pkging system — "Sean E. Russell" <ser@...> 2005/10/10

On Wednesday 28 September 2005 08:54, Hugh Sasse wrote:

[#6045] Re: gems is a language change, not a pkging system (Re: Require Namepaces and RubyGems' effect on LoadPath problem) — "Sean E. Russell" <ser@...> 2005/09/28

On Monday 26 September 2005 21:29, Austin Ziegler wrote:

[#6048] Re: gems is a language change, not a pkging system (Re: Require Namepaces and RubyGems' effect on LoadPath problem) — Austin Ziegler <halostatue@...> 2005/09/28

On 9/28/05, Sean E. Russell <ser@germane-software.com> wrote:

[#6059] Re: gems is a language change, not a pkging system (Re: Require Namepaces and RubyGems' effect on LoadPath problem) — Dominique Brezinski <dominique.brezinski@...> 2005/09/28

On 9/28/05, Austin Ziegler <halostatue@gmail.com> wrote:

[#6061] Re: gems is a language change, not a pkging system (Re: Require Namepaces and RubyGems' effect on LoadPath problem) — Austin Ziegler <halostatue@...> 2005/09/28

On 9/28/05, Dominique Brezinski <dominique.brezinski@gmail.com> wrote:

[#6062] Re: gems is a language change, not a pkging system (Re: Require Namepaces and RubyGems' effect on LoadPath problem) — Dominique Brezinski <dominique.brezinski@...> 2005/09/28

For what it is worth, I live life behind an authenticated proxy, so I

[#6099] Re: gems is a language change, not a pkging system (Re: Require Namepaces and RubyGems' effect on LoadPath problem) — "Sean E. Russell" <ser@...> 2005/09/30

On Wednesday 28 September 2005 08:43, Austin Ziegler wrote:

[#6009] Re: ruby 1.8.3 (2005-09-21) [i486-linux] sisu segfault — Ralph Amissah <ralph.amissah@...>

(i) correction, segfault is with official ruby 1.8.3 (2005-09-21), not

21 messages 2005/09/27
[#6010] Fwd: ruby 1.8.3 (2005-09-21) [i486-linux] sisu segfault — Ralph Amissah <ralph.amissah@...> 2005/09/27

[sorry for duplicate post]

[#6079] Re: Fwd: ruby 1.8.3 (2005-09-21) [i486-linux] sisu segfault — ts <decoux@...> 2005/09/29

>>>>> "R" == Ralph Amissah <ralph.amissah@gmail.com> writes:

[#6081] Re: Fwd: ruby 1.8.3 (2005-09-21) [i486-linux] sisu segfault — ts <decoux@...> 2005/09/29

>>>>> "t" == ts <decoux@moulon.inra.fr> writes:

[#6082] Re: Fwd: ruby 1.8.3 (2005-09-21) [i486-linux] sisu segfault — Tanaka Akira <akr@...17n.org> 2005/09/29

In article <200509291419.j8TEJYid015419@moulon.inra.fr>,

Re: RubyGems in Ruby HEAD

From: Marc Dequènes (Duck) <Duck@...>
Date: 2005-09-21 20:08:41 UTC
List: ruby-core #5870
Coin,

Replying to Austin and other ppl btw...


mathew <meta@pobox.com> writes:

> Are you actually intending to produce Debian .deb packages for every Gem?

Yes we DO for most of them.
How do you think the thousands of source packages are maintained in
Debian ? Automagically ?

Packagers too are willing to have a common solution for Ruby
distribution so as to simplify our work. Packaging similar things is
easier, and with a common system it would be even easier. In fact
this system should be flexible enought to allow GNU/*, *BSD,
... distributions to integrate them cleanly and efficiently, what
RubyGems is currently not capable of.

Rubygems only target systems with no existing packaging system, and
forget the whole world is not doing this way. Should certain ppl then be
excluded ?

> I ask because coming from a Perl background, I've always found Debian's 
> packaging of CPAN libraries to be incomplete enough to be problematic. 
> For instance, last time I installed blosxom and some plugins, I had to 
> go to CPAN for some standard libraries that weren't available as Debian 
> packages. Once I have to go to CPAN even once, the value of repackaging 
> the libraries in Debian format is lost--in fact, it becomes a liability. 
> As others have already mentioned, you quickly end up with competing 
> versions of the same library.

That's what RFP (Request For Package) is for. I know this is a pain when
something is missing and you need it AT ONCE, but everything needs a
start and i did not find so many perl things waiting, last time i
checked the user requested softwares.

> I expect the situation will ultimately be the same with Ruby. Right now, 
> it might be feasible to repackage everything from RubyGems to .deb; but 
> I doubt that will continue to be the case, with an arbitrary number of 
> people writing Gems, and a small number of Gem to Debian repackagers.

A Perl Team was created and organized and the situation has much
improved. Indeed not considering our problems would lead to the same
starting situation with Ruby, because motivated ppl will soon leave the
place and work for another project if we continue facing a silent wall
or a wall saying "i don't care".

Debian, Mandriva, RedHat, and the like, have got plenty of users, which
cannot compare to the small amount of RubyGems users, and moreover of
RubyGems fans thinking this system is perfect, and i don't think such a
reply Austin did would bring ppl to continue contributing to Ruby at
all.

We packagers are also users, and we also speak for our amount of users,
and there is no way ppl can be treated like Austin did. If you want Ruby
out of Debian/Mandriva/RedHat/..., then go ahead. Software maintained by
ppl taking only care of their own wishes considering users in a such
Marillat-style should not be packaged or even used.

> The solution I would like to see would be the one taken by Gentoo for 
> CPAN--provide a wrapper which incorporates the language's packaging 
> system in the Linux distribution's packaging system. With Gentoo I run a 
> script naming a CPAN package, and it builds a portage package for that 
> CPAN package (or downloads the pre-packaged Portage package if one 
> exists). That way, both Portage and CPAN agree about what's installed.

Most distribution are precompiled ones, so this cannot apply. We are
thinking about solutions, but it seems it is full of pitfalls (plus the
ones we cannot see yet). More on this later, when things are clearer
into our mind.

> Anyhow... I'm making a mental note to release a setup.rb version of my 
> forthcoming library as well as a Gem...

Thanks a lot.

-- 
Marc Dequ竪nes (Duck)

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