[#347506] how do you do this — George George <george.githinji@...>

Given an array of strings e.g.

20 messages 2009/10/01

[#347686] what do you enjoy in a ruby quiz? — Martin DeMello <martindemello@...>

I've noticed that the ruby quiz has been getting few responses of

22 messages 2009/10/04

[#347700] Count the number of times an element occurs in an array — Jim Burgess <jack.zelig@...>

Hi,

13 messages 2009/10/05

[#347715] regex simplifier? — Roger Pack <rogerpack2005@...>

Question.

17 messages 2009/10/05

[#347765] Ruby for the wrong reason — flebber <flebber.crue@...>

Hi

39 messages 2009/10/06
[#347774] Re: Ruby for the wrong reason — 7stud -- <bbxx789_05ss@...> 2009/10/06

flebber wrote:

[#347800] Re: Ruby for the wrong reason — James Edward Gray II <james@...> 2009/10/06

On Oct 6, 2009, at 1:16 AM, 7stud -- wrote:

[#347821] Re: Ruby for the wrong reason — 7stud -- <bbxx789_05ss@...> 2009/10/06

James Edward Gray II wrote:

[#347830] How to not display output of a system call. — Jerry Mr <jerry.piazza@...>

Lets say I have a Windows command line program that runs the following:

11 messages 2009/10/06

[#347871] Google Wave- I need contacts! — Tim Mcd <tmcdowell@...>

After 6 days, i finally got my gWave invite! ('and there was much

21 messages 2009/10/07
[#347889] Re: Google Wave- I need contacts! — Andrew Timberlake <andrew@...> 2009/10/07

Well, you could share the love (I'd love an invite) and build contacts

[#347899] Re: Google Wave- I need contacts! — Tim Mcd <tmcdowell@...> 2009/10/07

Andrew Timberlake wrote:

[#347904] Re: Google Wave- I need contacts! — Rajinder Yadav <devguy.ca@...> 2009/10/07

Tim, when they restrict the rules you could ping this group for an

[#347909] Re: Google Wave- I need contacts! — Tim Mcd <tmcdowell@...> 2009/10/07

Rajinder Yadav wrote:

[#349016] Re: Google Wave- I need contacts! — Jarod Reid <jarod@...> 2009/10/28

i'd like an invite if you have a spare

[#350049] Re: Google Wave- I need contacts! — Rajinder Yadav <devguy.ca@...> 2009/11/10

Jarod Reid wrote:

[#350081] Re: Google Wave- I need contacts! — Michael Weller <gibbsnich@...> 2009/11/10

Uhh, didn't hear of google wave before.

[#348042] Windows Ruby Version Check — James Edward Gray II <james@...>

Can a Windows Ruby user please confirm that the "Ruby 1.9.1-p129

11 messages 2009/10/09

[#348100] Class Level inheritable attributes - are we there yet? — dreamcat four <dreamcat4@...>

Hi,

34 messages 2009/10/10
[#348103] Re: Class Level inheritable attributes - are we there yet? — "David A. Black" <dblack@...> 2009/10/10

Hi --

[#348104] Re: Class Level inheritable attributes - are we there yet? — dreamcat four <dreamcat4@...> 2009/10/10

The problem with class variables in Ruby, is that a class variable is

[#348136] Re: Class Level inheritable attributes - are we there yet? — Robert Klemme <shortcutter@...> 2009/10/11

On 10/10/2009 08:59 PM, dreamcat four wrote:

[#348200] Re: Class Level inheritable attributes - are we there yet? — "ara.t.howard" <ara.t.howard@...> 2009/10/12

[#348231] Re: Class Level inheritable attributes - are we there yet? — "David A. Black" <dblack@...> 2009/10/12

On Tue, 13 Oct 2009, ara.t.howard wrote:

[#348248] Re: Class Level inheritable attributes - are we there yet? — "ara.t.howard" <ara.t.howard@...> 2009/10/13

On Mon, Oct 12, 2009 at 17:48, David A. Black <dblack@rubypal.com> wrote:

[#348258] Re: Class Level inheritable attributes - are we there yet? — Robert Klemme <shortcutter@...> 2009/10/13

2009/10/13 ara.t.howard <ara.t.howard@gmail.com>:

[#348169] Does ruby.h overrides C "enum"? — Iñaki Baz Castillo <ibc@...>

Hi, writting a Ruby C extension (for 1.8 or 1.9) I get an error when using

19 messages 2009/10/12

[#348281] how to solve a special JRuby and Java syntax conflict? — "Axel Etzold" <AEtzold@...>

Dear all,

15 messages 2009/10/13
[#348285] Re: how to solve a special JRuby and Java syntax conflict? — Paul Smith <paul@...> 2009/10/13

On Tue, Oct 13, 2009 at 8:52 PM, Axel Etzold <AEtzold@gmx.de> wrote:

[#348286] Re: how to solve a special JRuby and Java syntax conflict? — Paul Smith <paul@...> 2009/10/13

On Tue, Oct 13, 2009 at 9:52 PM, Paul Smith <paul@pollyandpaul.co.uk> wrote:

[#348287] Re: how to solve a special JRuby and Java syntax conflict? — "Axel Etzold" <AEtzold@...> 2009/10/13

Dear Paul,

[#348290] Re: how to solve a special JRuby and Java syntax conflict? — "Walton Hoops" <walton@...> 2009/10/13

Axel Etzold wrote:

[#348325] Re: how to solve a special JRuby and Java syntax conflict? — "Axel Etzold" <AEtzold@...> 2009/10/14

[#348317] deep cloning, how? — Rajinder Yadav <devguy.ca@...>

I am trying to figure out how to perform a deep clone

29 messages 2009/10/14
[#348330] Re: deep cloning, how? — Robert Klemme <shortcutter@...> 2009/10/14

2009/10/14 Rajinder Yadav <devguy.ca@gmail.com>:

[#348366] Re: deep cloning, how? — Caleb Clausen <vikkous@...> 2009/10/14

On 10/14/09, Robert Klemme <shortcutter@googlemail.com> wrote:

[#348379] Re: deep cloning, how? — Robert Klemme <shortcutter@...> 2009/10/14

On 14.10.2009 19:03, Caleb Clausen wrote:

[#348428] Re: deep cloning, how? — Caleb Clausen <vikkous@...> 2009/10/15

On 10/14/09, Robert Klemme <shortcutter@googlemail.com> wrote:

[#348449] Re: deep cloning, how? — Brian Candler <b.candler@...> 2009/10/16

Caleb Clausen wrote:0

[#348339] Hey you! Stop using relative requires! — Intransition <transfire@...>

I recently came across two different programs that had this line in a

22 messages 2009/10/14
[#348365] Re: Hey you! Stop using relative requires! — Tony Arcieri <tony@...> 2009/10/14

On Wed, Oct 14, 2009 at 6:01 AM, Intransition <transfire@gmail.com> wrote:

[#348401] matching against a zillion patterns — George George <george.githinji@...>

i have some script in which i would like to match a string against

18 messages 2009/10/15

[#348486] Dynamic nested each in ruby 1.8.7? — Toi Toi <toi@...>

How can one have a function that uses a dynamic amount of each

15 messages 2009/10/18

[#348570] memory leak — Rob Doug <broken.m@...>

Hi all,

27 messages 2009/10/20
[#348647] Re: memory leak — Robert Klemme <shortcutter@...> 2009/10/20

On 20.10.2009 03:10, Rob Doug wrote:

[#348655] Re: memory leak — Rob Doug <broken.m@...> 2009/10/20

[#348679] Re: memory leak — Robert Klemme <shortcutter@...> 2009/10/21

On 21.10.2009 00:47, Rob Doug wrote:

[#348718] Re: memory leak — Rob Doug <broken.m@...> 2009/10/22

> You could print out object statistics to get an idea about the source of

[#348727] Creating and raising custom exception in Ruby C extension — Iñaki Baz Castillo <ibc@...>

Hi, I'm trying to create a CustomError exception in a Ruby C extension and raise it:

8 messages 2009/10/22

[#348738] convert/replace a value of nil with 0? — Mmcolli00 Mom <mmc_collins@...>

Do you know how I can convert or replace any value that gets back a

12 messages 2009/10/22

[#348825] mail — Mikel Lindsaar <raasdnil@...>

Some of you might know about a little gem that Minero Aoki wrote called tmail.

15 messages 2009/10/25

[#348877] Array#collect in a method call, not working for me — Michael Randall <randallsata@...>

I am sure I'm making a newbie mistake, as I've just started learning

9 messages 2009/10/26

[#349004] duby 0.0.1 Released — Charles Oliver Nutter <headius@...>

duby version 0.0.1 has been released!

18 messages 2009/10/27
[#349007] Re: [ANN] duby 0.0.1 Released — "Bill Kelly" <billk@...> 2009/10/27

[#349022] Closures / lambda question — Aldric Giacomoni <aldric@...>

This is something I don't understand, and did not understand when I

13 messages 2009/10/28

[#349024] Desktop GUI apps in Ruby — Marnen Laibow-Koser <marnen@...>

Hi folks!

35 messages 2009/10/28

[#349099] Ruby can't subtract ? — Aldric Giacomoni <aldric@...>

I found this blog entry:

25 messages 2009/10/28
[#349100] Re: Ruby can't subtract ? — "Matthew K. Williams" <matt@...> 2009/10/28

On Thu, 29 Oct 2009, Aldric Giacomoni wrote:

[#349183] Using multicore CPUs in parallel tasks — Marc Hoeppner <marc.hoeppner@...>

Hi,

19 messages 2009/10/29
[#349203] Re: Using multicore CPUs in parallel tasks — Glen Holcomb <damnbigman@...> 2009/10/29

On Thu, Oct 29, 2009 at 8:56 AM, Marc Hoeppner

[#349221] Re: Using multicore CPUs in parallel tasks — Tony Arcieri <tony@...> 2009/10/29

On Thu, Oct 29, 2009 at 11:48 AM, Glen Holcomb <damnbigman@gmail.com> wrote:

[#349253] Ruby doesn't implement x++ for Fixnum's because ??? — RichardOnRails <RichardDummyMailbox58407@...>

Hi,

159 messages 2009/10/30
[#349303] Re: Ruby doesn't implement x++ for Fixnum's because ??? — RichardOnRails <RichardDummyMailbox58407@...> 2009/10/30

On Oct 29, 9:18瀾m, RichardOnRails

[#349307] Re: Ruby doesn't implement x++ for Fixnum's because ??? — Robert Klemme <shortcutter@...> 2009/10/30

2009/10/30 RichardOnRails <RichardDummyMailbox58407@uscomputergurus.com>:

[#349337] Re: Ruby doesn't implement x++ for Fixnum's because ??? — Rick DeNatale <rick.denatale@...> 2009/10/30

On Fri, Oct 30, 2009 at 11:05 AM, Robert Klemme

[#349600] Re: Ruby doesn't implement x++ for Fixnum's because ??? — Tony Arcieri <tony@...> 2009/11/04

On Fri, Oct 30, 2009 at 12:03 PM, Rick DeNatale <rick.denatale@gmail.com>wrote:

[#349606] Re: Ruby doesn't implement x++ for Fixnum's because ??? — "Michael W. Ryder" <_mwryder55@...> 2009/11/04

Tony Arcieri wrote:

[#349607] Re: Ruby doesn't implement x++ for Fixnum's because ??? — Tony Arcieri <tony@...> 2009/11/04

On Tue, Nov 3, 2009 at 10:30 PM, Michael W. Ryder <_mwryder55@gmail.com>wrote:

[#349611] Re: Ruby doesn't implement x++ for Fixnum's because ??? — Charles Oliver Nutter <headius@...> 2009/11/04

Of course I had to jump in here.

[#349633] Re: Ruby doesn't implement x++ for Fixnum's because ??? — Rick DeNatale <rick.denatale@...> 2009/11/04

On Wed, Nov 4, 2009 at 1:58 AM, Charles Oliver Nutter

[#349635] Re: Ruby doesn't implement x++ for Fixnum's because ??? — Marnen Laibow-Koser <marnen@...> 2009/11/04

Rick Denatale wrote:

[#349621] Re: Ruby doesn't implement x++ for Fixnum's because ??? — Gavin Sinclair <gsinclair@...> 2009/11/04

On Nov 4, 5:58m, Charles Oliver Nutter <head...@headius.com> wrote:

[#349654] Re: Ruby doesn't implement x++ for Fixnum's because ??? — Tony Arcieri <tony@...> 2009/11/04

On Wed, Nov 4, 2009 at 3:55 AM, Gavin Sinclair <gsinclair@gmail.com> wrote:

[#349665] Re: Ruby doesn't implement x++ for Fixnum's because ??? — "Walton Hoops" <walton@...> 2009/11/04

> -----Original Message-----

[#349671] Re: Ruby doesn't implement x++ for Fixnum's because ??? — "Michael W. Ryder" <_mwryder55@...> 2009/11/04

Walton Hoops wrote:

[#349682] Re: Ruby doesn't implement x++ for Fixnum's because ??? — "Walton Hoops" <walton@...> 2009/11/04

> -----Original Message-----

[#349688] Re: Ruby doesn't implement x++ for Fixnum's because ??? — "Michael W. Ryder" <_mwryder55@...> 2009/11/04

Walton Hoops wrote:

[#349689] Re: Ruby doesn't implement x++ for Fixnum's because ??? — Marnen Laibow-Koser <marnen@...> 2009/11/04

Michael W. Ryder wrote:

[#349693] Re: Ruby doesn't implement x++ for Fixnum's because ??? — "Walton Hoops" <walton@...> 2009/11/04

> -----Original Message-----

[#349814] Re: Ruby doesn't implement x++ for Fixnum's because ??? — Seebs <usenet-nospam@...> 2009/11/06

On 2009-11-06, David A. Black <dblack@rubypal.com> wrote:

[#349879] Re: Ruby doesn't implement x++ for Fixnum's because ??? — Tony Arcieri <tony@...> 2009/11/08

On Fri, Nov 6, 2009 at 4:30 PM, Seebs <usenet-nospam@seebs.net> wrote:

[#349880] Re: Ruby doesn't implement x++ for Fixnum's because ??? — Rick DeNatale <rick.denatale@...> 2009/11/08

On Sun, Nov 8, 2009 at 11:48 AM, Tony Arcieri <tony@medioh.com> wrote:

[#349885] Re: Ruby doesn't implement x++ for Fixnum's because ??? — Tony Arcieri <tony@...> 2009/11/08

On Sun, Nov 8, 2009 at 10:45 AM, Rick DeNatale <rick.denatale@gmail.com>wrote:

[#349886] Re: Ruby doesn't implement x++ for Fixnum's because ??? — Marnen Laibow-Koser <marnen@...> 2009/11/08

Tony Arcieri wrote:

[#349887] Re: Ruby doesn't implement x++ for Fixnum's because ??? — Tony Arcieri <tony@...> 2009/11/08

On Sun, Nov 8, 2009 at 11:22 AM, Marnen Laibow-Koser <marnen@marnen.org>wrote:

[#349889] Re: Ruby doesn't implement x++ for Fixnum's because ??? — "Walton Hoops" <walton@...> 2009/11/08

> -----Original Message-----

[#349892] Re: Ruby doesn't implement x++ for Fixnum's because ??? — Tony Arcieri <tony@...> 2009/11/08

On Sun, Nov 8, 2009 at 11:49 AM, Walton Hoops <walton@vyper.hopto.org>wrote:

[#349898] Re: Ruby doesn't implement x++ for Fixnum's because ??? — "Walton Hoops" <walton@...> 2009/11/08

> From: bascule@gmail.com [mailto:bascule@gmail.com] On Behalf Of Tony

[#349900] Re: Ruby doesn't implement x++ for Fixnum's because ??? — Tony Arcieri <tony@...> 2009/11/08

On Sun, Nov 8, 2009 at 1:15 PM, Walton Hoops <walton@vyper.hopto.org> wrote:

[#349980] Re: Ruby doesn't implement x++ for Fixnum's because ??? — Seebs <usenet-nospam@...> 2009/11/09

On 2009-11-09, Marnen Laibow-Koser <marnen@marnen.org> wrote:

[#349988] Re: Ruby doesn't implement x++ for Fixnum's because ??? — Rick DeNatale <rick.denatale@...> 2009/11/09

On Mon, Nov 9, 2009 at 8:40 AM, Seebs <usenet-nospam@seebs.net> wrote:

[#349989] Re: Ruby doesn't implement x++ for Fixnum's because ??? — Marnen Laibow-Koser <marnen@...> 2009/11/09

Rick Denatale wrote:

[#349994] Re: Ruby doesn't implement x++ for Fixnum's because ??? — Aldric Giacomoni <aldric@...> 2009/11/09

Marnen Laibow-Koser wrote:

[#349264] How do you get the tail end of a string? — "Just Another Victim of the Ambient Morality" <ihatespam@...>

I'm actually hoping this is an embarrassing question but how do you get

55 messages 2009/10/30
[#349266] Re: How do you get the tail end of a string? — "Michael W. Ryder" <_mwryder55@...> 2009/10/30

Just Another Victim of the Ambient Morality wrote:

[#349267] Re: How do you get the tail end of a string? — "Michael W. Ryder" <_mwryder55@...> 2009/10/30

Michael W. Ryder wrote:

[#349286] Re: How do you get the tail end of a string? — Bertram Scharpf <lists@...> 2009/10/30

Hi,

[#349323] Merging hashes using both symbols and strings as keys — shenry <stuarthenry@...>

I'm trying to merge to hashes, one using symbols as keys (the defined

15 messages 2009/10/30
[#349528] Re: Merging hashes using both symbols and strings as keys — Josh Cheek <josh.cheek@...> 2009/11/03

On Fri, Oct 30, 2009 at 11:10 AM, shenry <stuarthenry@gmail.com> wrote:

[#349352] In-place parameter modification — Dave Anderson <anderson@...>

Native to ruby are several methods that change passed-in parameters

17 messages 2009/10/30

[#349406] Hamurabi (#223) — Daniel Moore <yahivin@...>

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-

23 messages 2009/10/31
[#349451] Re: [QUIZ] Hamurabi (#223) — James Edward Gray II <james@...> 2009/11/01

On Oct 31, 2009, at 6:23 PM, Daniel Moore wrote:

[#349498] Re: [QUIZ] Hamurabi (#223) — Martin DeMello <martindemello@...> 2009/11/02

On Mon, Nov 2, 2009 at 5:29 AM, James Edward Gray II

Re: deep cloning, how?

From: Robert Klemme <shortcutter@...>
Date: 2009-10-19 15:10:06 UTC
List: ruby-talk #348531
On 10/19/2009 10:32 AM, Brian Candler wrote:
> Robert Klemme wrote:
>> 2009/10/16 lith <minilith@gmail.com>:
>>>> But I think the spirit of dup
>>>> described above is that dup defined in a subclass should initialize it
>>>> using its constructor.
>> Brian, I disagree.  The proper way is to implement #initialize_copy.
>> That way you can make sure you do not get aliasing effects even if
>> source and copy are frozen because in #initialize_copy frozen state is
>> not applied.
> 
> I don't understand what you mean by that. If #dup calls self.class.new 
> then you obviously get a new and hence unfrozen object.
> 
> It is certainly true that the *default* implementation of both #dup and 
> #clone (defined in Object) calls initialize_copy. A generic #dup must 
> behave this way; it doesn't know what the new() method arguments are in 
> any particular subclass of Object. I don't think this should be taken as 
> necessarily implying that you are expected to leave #dup alone in your 
> own classes, and only override #initialize_copy instead.
> 
> The way I read the documentation implies to me that #dup in user defined 
> classes *should* call new. Silly example:
> 
>   class NewsReader
>     def initialize(url, state_filename)
>       @url = url
>       @http_client = HTTPClient.new(@url)
>       @state_filename = state_filename
>       @state_file = File.open(@state_filename)
>     end
>     def dup
>       self.class.new(@url, @state_filename.dup)
>     end
>   end
> 
> Here the logic of how to build a NewsReader, including building all the 
> associated helper objects, is built into the #initialize method.

Brian, the approach shown above does not work well with subclasses.  The 
code attempts to be safe with regard to inheritance (by doing 
self.class.new instead of NewsReader.new) but it will fail miserably as 
soon as a sub class constructor has a different argument list (which is 
not too uncommon).

I completely agree with Rick here: the comment in Object#dup is probably 
outdated.  The most reasonable way to customize object cloning *and* 
dupping is to implement #initialize_copy in a way to at least ensure no 
aliasing of unfrozen members takes place.

> I don't 
> think you would want to duplicate all this logic in #initialize_copy. 

You would not duplicate the logic from #initialize in #initialize_copy 
because #initialize_copy does a completely different job: it copies 
state of an instance which is known to be consistent and just needs to 
ensure that aliasing of object references does not break your class 
invariants later accidentally.  This is the reason why in 
#initialize_copy different logic should be applied - even for shallow 
copies!  Method #initialize OTOH needs to work with its arguments which 
were provided from the outside (outside of this class that is) and may 
not meet expectations or valid ranges.

> Furthermore, I think I would expect #clone only to copy the top object, 
> and leave all the instance variables aliased.

As far as I can see both #clone and #dup are meant to do shallow copies 
but I may be wrong here.  At least this is what the contract ob Object 
promises and I tend to be cautious about changing such things.  Even if 
you redefine semantics to being deep copy for certain classes then 
implementing it in #initialize_copy is superior to other approaches IMHO.

> Obviously there are no hard-and-fast rules here, and with Ruby there are 
> many ways to achieve the same goal.

That's true.  But I would say at least when considering inheritance some 
ways are better than others.  In fact I have been doing self.class.new 
most of the time in #dup because I completely forgot about 
#initialize_copy.  But I will certainly change that habit from now on.

> I'd certainly agree this is an area where Ruby's documentation falls 
> short.

Right.

> Taking another example: I don't think you'll disagree that 99% of the 
> time you are expected to leave Object.new alone and instead define 
> #initialize in your own classes. But you wouldn't find that out from the 
> documentation:
> 
> $ ri Object.new
> ------------------------------------------------------------ Object::new
>      Object::new()
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>      Not documented
> 
> $ ri Object#initialize
> Nothing known about Object#initialize

Funny that you mention it: #new and #initialize on one side and #dup / 
#clone and #initialize_copy on the other side have one thing in common: 
object allocation is separated from initialization.  I believe this was 
a wise decision because that way allocation policies can be implemented 
easier than in languages like C++ and Java where both are inseparable.

For example, you can add your own #deep_dup to the language:

class Object
   def deep_dup
     cp = self.class.allocate

     instance_variables.each do |var|
       cp.instance_variable_set(instance_variable_get(var))
     end

     cp.initialize_deep_copy(self)

     cp
   end

   def initialize_deep_copy(source)
     # nothing to do here
   end
end

class String
   def initialize_deep_copy(source)
     replace source
   end
end

# note this implementation is not robust against
# circles in the object graph!
class Array
   def initialize_deep_copy(source)
     source.each do |y|
       self << y.deep_dup
     end
   end
end

a = %w{foo bar baz}
b = a.dup
b[2].replace "CHANGED"

p a, b

a = %w{foo bar baz}
b = a.deep_dup
b[2].replace "CHANGED"

p a, b


Kind regards

	robert

-- 
remember.guy do |as, often| as.you_can - without end
http://blog.rubybestpractices.com/

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