[#18436] [ANN] Ruby 1.9.1 feature freeze — "Yugui (Yuki Sonoda)" <yugui@...>

Hi all,

81 messages 2008/09/02
[#18667] Re: [ANN] Ruby 1.9.1 feature freeze — "Yusuke ENDOH" <mame@...> 2008/09/17

Hi,

[#18847] Re: [ANN] Ruby 1.9.1 feature freeze — "Yugui (Yuki Sonoda)" <yugui@...> 2008/09/24

Hi, Yusuke

[#18848] Re: [ANN] Ruby 1.9.1 feature freeze — "Yusuke ENDOH" <mame@...> 2008/09/24

Hi,

[#18886] Re: [ANN] Ruby 1.9.1 feature freeze — Ryan Davis <ryand-ruby@...> 2008/09/25

[#18889] Re: [ANN] Ruby 1.9.1 feature freeze — SASADA Koichi <ko1@...> 2008/09/25

Ryan Davis wrote:

[#18906] Re: [ANN] Ruby 1.9.1 feature freeze — Dave Thomas <dave@...> 2008/09/25

[#18908] Re: [ANN] Ruby 1.9.1 feature freeze — SASADA Koichi <ko1@...> 2008/09/25

Dave Thomas wrote:

[#19032] Re: [ANN] Ruby 1.9.1 feature freeze — Ryan Davis <ryand-ruby@...> 2008/09/30

[#19036] Re: [ANN] Ruby 1.9.1 feature freeze — Jim Weirich <jim.weirich@...> 2008/09/30

[#19039] Re: [ANN] Ruby 1.9.1 feature freeze — Ryan Davis <ryand-ruby@...> 2008/09/30

[#19042] Re: [ANN] Ruby 1.9.1 feature freeze — Dave Thomas <dave@...> 2008/09/30

[#19195] Re: [ANN] Ruby 1.9.1 feature freeze — Ryan Davis <ryand-ruby@...> 2008/10/08

[#19202] Re: [ANN] Ruby 1.9.1 feature freeze — "Austin Ziegler" <halostatue@...> 2008/10/08

On Wed, Oct 8, 2008 at 3:05 AM, Ryan Davis <ryand-ruby@zenspider.com> wrote=

[#19203] Re: [ANN] Ruby 1.9.1 feature freeze — Paul Brannan <pbrannan@...> 2008/10/08

On Wed, Oct 08, 2008 at 09:28:22PM +0900, Austin Ziegler wrote:

[#18452] [ANN] Ruby 1.9.1 feature freeze — "Roger Pack" <rogerpack2005@...>

Would it be possible to have a few patches applied before freeze [if

27 messages 2008/09/04
[#18471] Re: [ANN] Ruby 1.9.1 feature freeze — Yukihiro Matsumoto <matz@...> 2008/09/06

Hi,

[#18490] Re: [ANN] Ruby 1.9.1 feature freeze — Nobuyoshi Nakada <nobu@...> 2008/09/08

Hi,

[#18486] Ruby 1.9 strings & character encoding — "Michael Selig" <michael.selig@...>

Firstly, I apologise if I am going over old ground here - I haven't been

39 messages 2008/09/08
[#18492] Re: Ruby 1.9 strings & character encoding — Yukihiro Matsumoto <matz@...> 2008/09/08

Hi,

[#18494] Re: Ruby 1.9 strings & character encoding — "Michael Selig" <michael.selig@...> 2008/09/08

On Mon, 08 Sep 2008 19:45:36 +1000, Yukihiro Matsumoto

[#18499] Re: Ruby 1.9 strings & character encoding — "NARUSE, Yui" <naruse@...> 2008/09/08

Hi,

[#18500] Re: Ruby 1.9 strings & character encoding — Tim Bray <Tim.Bray@...> 2008/09/08

On Sep 8, 2008, at 10:43 AM, NARUSE, Yui wrote:

[#18515] Re: Ruby 1.9 strings & character encoding — Urabe Shyouhei <shyouhei@...> 2008/09/09

# First off, I'm neutral to this issue

[#18530] Re: Ruby 1.9 strings & character encoding — Tim Bray <Tim.Bray@...> 2008/09/10

On Sep 8, 2008, at 9:06 PM, Urabe Shyouhei wrote:

[#18533] Re: Ruby 1.9 strings & character encoding — Tanaka Akira <akr@...> 2008/09/10

In article <3119E5AB-AEC8-4FEE-B2FA-8C75482E0E9D@sun.com>,

[#18504] Re: Ruby 1.9 strings & character encoding — "Michael Selig" <michael.selig@...> 2008/09/09

On Tue, 09 Sep 2008 03:43:54 +1000, NARUSE, Yui <naruse@airemix.jp> wrote:

[#18572] Working on CSV's Encoding Support — James Gray <james@...>

I'm trying to get the standard CSV library ready for m17n in Ruby

23 messages 2008/09/13
[#18575] Re: Working on CSV's Encoding Support — James Gray <james@...> 2008/09/14

On Sep 13, 2008, at 5:39 PM, James Gray wrote:

[#18576] Re: Working on CSV's Encoding Support — "Michael Selig" <michael.selig@...> 2008/09/14

On Sun, 14 Sep 2008 14:48:47 +1000, James Gray <james@grayproductions.net>

[#18640] Character encodings - a radical suggestion — "Michael Selig" <michael.selig@...>

Hi,

89 messages 2008/09/17
[#18643] Re: Character encodings - a radical suggestion — James Gray <james@...> 2008/09/17

On Sep 16, 2008, at 8:20 PM, Michael Selig wrote:

[#18647] Re: Character encodings - a radical suggestion — "Michael Selig" <michael.selig@...> 2008/09/17

On Wed, 17 Sep 2008 12:51:14 +1000, James Gray <james@grayproductions.net>

[#18658] Re: Character encodings - a radical suggestion — James Gray <james@...> 2008/09/17

On Sep 16, 2008, at 11:21 PM, Michael Selig wrote:

[#18660] Re: Character encodings - a radical suggestion — "NARUSE, Yui" <naruse@...> 2008/09/17

Hi,

[#18663] Re: Character encodings - a radical suggestion — Matthias Wächter <matthias@...> 2008/09/17

On 9/17/2008 3:39 PM, NARUSE, Yui wrote:

[#18666] Re: Character encodings - a radical suggestion — Yukihiro Matsumoto <matz@...> 2008/09/17

Hi,

[#18728] Re: Character encodings - a radical suggestion — Martin Duerst <duerst@...> 2008/09/19

At 00:01 08/09/18, Yukihiro Matsumoto wrote:

[#18729] Re: Character encodings - a radical suggestion — Yukihiro Matsumoto <matz@...> 2008/09/19

Hi,

[#18732] Re: Character encodings - a radical suggestion — "Michael Selig" <michael.selig@...> 2008/09/19

On Fri, 19 Sep 2008 18:24:41 +1000, Yukihiro Matsumoto

[#18734] Re: Character encodings - a radical suggestion — Yukihiro Matsumoto <matz@...> 2008/09/19

Oops, I misfired my mail reader; the following is the right one:

[#18751] Re: Character encodings - a radical suggestion — "Michael Selig" <michael.selig@...> 2008/09/20

On Fri, 19 Sep 2008 19:52:30 +1000, Yukihiro Matsumoto

[#18761] Re: Character encodings - a radical suggestion — Yukihiro Matsumoto <matz@...> 2008/09/20

Hi,

[#18774] Re: Character encodings - a radical suggestion — "Michael Selig" <michael.selig@...> 2008/09/21

On Sun, 21 Sep 2008 02:05:30 +1000, Yukihiro Matsumoto

[#18776] Re: Character encodings - a less radical suggestion — Martin Duerst <duerst@...> 2008/09/22

Hello Michael,

[#18664] Re: Character encodings - a radical suggestion — Yukihiro Matsumoto <matz@...> 2008/09/17

Hi,

[#18762] [Feature #578] add method to disassemble Proc objects — Roger Pack <redmine@...>

Feature #578: add method to disassemble Proc objects

17 messages 2008/09/20

[#18872] [RIP] Guy Decoux. — "Jean-Fran輟is Tr穗" <jftran@...>

Hello,

14 messages 2008/09/24

[#18899] refute_{equal, match, nil, same} is not useful — Fujioka <fuj@...>

Hi,

27 messages 2008/09/25

[#18937] A stupid question... — Dave Thomas <dave@...>

Just what was wrong with Test::Unit? Sure, it was slightly bloated.

25 messages 2008/09/25
[#18941] Re: A stupid question... — "Berger, Daniel" <Daniel.Berger@...> 2008/09/25

> -----Original Message-----

[#19004] Let Ruby be Ruby — Trans <transfire@...> 2008/09/28

[#18986] miniunit problems and release of Ruby 1.9.0-5 — "Yugui (Yuki Sonoda)" <yugui@...>

Hi,

14 messages 2008/09/27

[#19043] Ruby is "stealing" names from operating system API:s — "Johan Holmberg" <johan556@...>

Hi!

13 messages 2008/09/30

[ruby-core:18682] Re: Character encodings - a radical suggestion

From: "Austin Ziegler" <halostatue@...>
Date: 2008-09-18 00:42:38 UTC
List: ruby-core #18682
On Wed, Sep 17, 2008 at 10:09 AM, Matthias W=E4chter
<matthias@waechter.wiz.at> wrote:
> Is there a complete characterization of this whole problem? It seems
> to be the main reason for sticking to non-UTF-8 character sets in
> Ruby these days, and concluding from what I have read about it, a
> solution could be the addition of missing characters/codepoints to
> Unicode. Why does no-one consider going that way, but instead builds
> a complicated stack of functions for conversions on top level?

While there is a private use plane, it's not generally interoperable
to use the private use plane in Unicode. Adding glyphs to Unicode is a
lengthy process that requires going through a standards body. The
Unicode standard is updated every few years, but the Unicode
consortium is much more likely to listen to the Japanese standards
bodies than Ruby programmers.

> To some extent, it looks like 'some' people like insisting on the
> status quo as it makes them feel special, swimming upstream the
> Unicode waterfall, retaining on regional locales instead of solving
> the issue. I do explicitly not refer to Ruby or the developers, they
> just accept these special needs more than other computer language
> designers with less sympathy for this anomaly.

The reality is that Unicode *doesn't* completely represent all Asian
languages well (see the discussions around Han unification for a brief
primer on the issues involved). The problem is exacerbated in the
academic arena where people want to be able to represent ancient
characters accurately, but it's not limited to that. Just because you
and I can represent our words in under one hundred characters doesn't
mean that it's appropriate to do the same with others' languages.

It's getting better, but it's still not perfect.

> Nevertheless, a persisting fix is needed, and I think writing more
> and more clutches for encoding conversion goes the wrong way. This
> might still be needed for legacy file support, but day-to-day work
> should not have to deal with this issue so prominently.

Day-to-day work *doesn't*.

Deal with all of your stuff in a single encoding (UTF-8, UTF-16,
whatever) and you don't even have to think about it.

If you *ever* deal with more than one encoding, you're going to run
into this problem in *any* language.

Sorry.

-austin, still working on a blog post about a .NET Unicode/XML bug
--=20
Austin Ziegler * halostatue@gmail.com * http://www.halostatue.ca/
 * austin@halostatue.ca * http://www.halostatue.ca/feed/
 * austin@zieglers.ca

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