[#57185] Cipher book for ruby — Shannon Fang <xrfang@...>

Hi all ruby gurus there,

16 messages 2002/12/01

[#57228] What do some of Ruby's symbols mean? — "Gavin Sinclair" <gsinclair@...>

This could do with some community input before going to the FAQ. The format

31 messages 2002/12/01
[#57234] Re: [FAQ] What do some of Ruby's symbols mean? — dblack@... 2002/12/01

Hi --

[#57237] Re: [FAQ] What do some of Ruby's symbols mean? — Shannon Fang <xrfang@...> 2002/12/01

Hi David

[#57246] [Revised] What do some of Ruby's symbols mean? — "Gavin Sinclair" <gsinclair@...>

Thanks for the instant feedback. And apologies for the offensive late-night

11 messages 2002/12/01

[#57337] Memory consumption problem with recursion — squidster@... (Squidster)

Fellow Rubyists/Rubyians/Rubyans,

10 messages 2002/12/02

[#57349] [Revised again] What are the non-alphanumerical symbols in Ruby code? — "Gavin Sinclair" <gsinclair@...>

Folks,

13 messages 2002/12/02

[#57380] Ruby Book for People Who Aren't (Yet) Programmers — "Chris" <nemo@...>

Hello,

11 messages 2002/12/02

[#57403] Newsgroup — Daniel Carrera <dcarrera@...>

Hello,

28 messages 2002/12/02
[#57409] Re: Newsgroup — "Chris Morris" <chrismo@...> 2002/12/02

In addition, this mailing list is a mirror of the newsgroup, so there's no

[#57411] Re: Newsgroup — Daniel Carrera <dcarrera@...> 2002/12/02

Ruby Book for People Who Aren't (Yet) Programmers

[#57412] Re: Newsgroup — Mauricio Fern疣dez <batsman.geo@...> 2002/12/02

On Tue, Dec 03, 2002 at 04:50:10AM +0900, Daniel Carrera wrote:

[#57438] Re: Newsgroup — Daniel Carrera <dcarrera@...> 2002/12/03

> You might already have received it by now. Get used to receiving the

[#57439] Re: Newsgroup — "Gavin Sinclair" <gsinclair@...> 2002/12/03

[#57440] Re: Ruby Book for People Who Aren't (Yet) Programmers — Daniel Carrera <dcarrera@...> 2002/12/03

> I heard a little while back that there might be a Ruby book in the works for

[#57480] Re: Ruby Book for People Who Aren't (Yet) Programmers — Martin DeMello <martindemello@...> 2002/12/03

Daniel Carrera <dcarrera@math.umd.edu> wrote:

[#57598] Class variables problem — Peter Hickman <peter@...>

I have used

16 messages 2002/12/04

[#57694] Re: Ruby Book for People Who Aren't (Yet) Programmers — "Bill Kelly" <billk@...>

Hi,

13 messages 2002/12/05

[#57735] Re: elseif? — "Shannon Fang" <xrfang@...>

How about a vote? I vote to add elseif as an alternative... Least

20 messages 2002/12/05

[#57816] ratlast 0.1 -- embedded FORTH in Ruby — Mark Probert <probertm@...>

18 messages 2002/12/05

[#57826] Re: elseif? — "Ted" <ted@...>

Yuk! Ruby was presented to me as a 'clean' language.

38 messages 2002/12/05

[#57833] on error resume next — Shannon Fang <xrfang@...>

Hi,

22 messages 2002/12/05

[#57856] Buffered output on Windows — "Chris Pine" <nemo@...>

Quick question:

26 messages 2002/12/05

[#58093] Thank God for backups — Daniel Carrera <dcarrera@...>

I was working on the tutorial just now and wanted to delete all the *~

48 messages 2002/12/07
[#58096] Re: Thank God for backups — "Gavin Sinclair" <gsinclair@...> 2002/12/07

From: "Daniel Carrera" <dcarrera@math.umd.edu>

[#58188] The Ruby Way — Daniel Carrera <dcarrera@...>

What do people think of "The Ruby Way"?

18 messages 2002/12/08

[#58394] Ruby BUG when using PStore and fork — Jeremy Henty <jeremy@...>

PStore does not appear to play well with fork. This script

20 messages 2002/12/09

[#58438] warnings -w — Daniel Carrera <dcarrera@...>

Hello,

20 messages 2002/12/10
[#58439] Re: warnings -w — matz@... (Yukihiro Matsumoto) 2002/12/10

Hi,

[#58441] Re: warnings -w — Daniel Carrera <dcarrera@...> 2002/12/10

> It sets $VERBOSE to true, and gives you extra warnings on parsing.

[#58444] Re: warnings -w — matz@... (Yukihiro Matsumoto) 2002/12/10

[#58446] Re: warnings -w — Daniel Carrera <dcarrera@...> 2002/12/10

> |Thanks. Can you give me an example of a parsing warning that it would

[#58447] Re: warnings -w — matz@... (Yukihiro Matsumoto) 2002/12/10

Hi,

[#58473] Problems transporting nil values using XMLRPC (net/http ?) — Martin Hart <martin@...>

12 messages 2002/12/10

[#58479] Pymacs in ruby? — "Mike Campbell" <michael_s_campbell@...>

This is probably way, way OT, but has anyone considered something along the

15 messages 2002/12/10

[#58597] calling a perl script — max <max@...>

hi

17 messages 2002/12/11

[#58657] functional programming "style" — "zesar" <i_wont@...>

i discovered ruby some weeks ago and i have to say now that i'm through with

13 messages 2002/12/11

[#58662] Re: The coolest thing since sliced bread — "Garriss, Michael" <Michael.Garriss@...>

Ugh! Free write forces users into a new editor? I'm lost without Vim.

21 messages 2002/12/11

[#58677] help -- persuade my boss to adopt ruby — Shannon Fang <xrfang@...>

Hi Ruby Lovers,

18 messages 2002/12/11

[#58689] Re: [ANN] jabber4r 0.3.0 (doesn't work with raa-install) — ptkwt@...1.aracnet.com (Phil Tomson)

15 messages 2002/12/11
[#58751] Re: [ANN] jabber4r 0.3.0 (doesn't work with raa-install) — ptkwt@...1.aracnet.com (Phil Tomson) 2002/12/12

In article <20021211171825.GA2345@localhost.localdomain>,

[#58724] Problem loading extensions in OSX 10.2.2 — Dave Thomas <Dave@...>

12 messages 2002/12/12

[#58730] Re: do I really not understand inheritance?? — "Chris Pine" <nemo@...>

AHA!!!

22 messages 2002/12/12
[#58769] Re: do I really not understand inheritance?? — dblack@... 2002/12/12

Hi --

[#58785] Re: do I really not understand inheritance?? — "Chris Pine" <nemo@...> 2002/12/12

Hmm.... I see what you're saying, I think. I was going to give you a

[#58819] Re: do I really not understand inheritance?? — dblack@... 2002/12/12

Hi --

[#58738] Re: help -- persuade my boss to adopt ruby — "Ted" <ted@...>

Dang! Ugly American idioms...

15 messages 2002/12/12
[#58742] Re: help -- persuade my boss to adopt ruby — "Russ Freeman" <russ@...> 2002/12/12

My advice:

[#58804] Re: help -- persuade my boss to adopt ruby — "Shannon Fang" <xrfang@...>

>it's the MATZ'S position that Ruby will never be REAL WORLD language.

102 messages 2002/12/12
[#59161] Re: help -- persuade my boss to adopt ruby — "Hal E. Fulton" <hal9000@...> 2002/12/16

----- Original Message -----

[#59181] Re: help -- persuade my boss to adopt ruby — "Bulat Ziganshin" <bulatz@...> 2002/12/16

Hello Hal,

[#59295] Re: help -- persuade my boss to adopt ruby — "Rich" <rich@...> 2002/12/17

The problem lies in the fact that these statements are equal:

[#59325] Re: help -- persuade my boss to adopt ruby — Austin Ziegler <austin@...> 2002/12/17

On Tue, 17 Dec 2002 16:49:47 +0900, Rich wrote:

[#59407] Re: help -- persuade my boss to adopt ruby — "Gavin Sinclair" <gsinclair@...> 2002/12/18

From: "Dan Sugalski" <dan@sidhe.org>

[#58870] replace setup.rb/install.rb with builtin module — ptkwt@...1.aracnet.com (Phil Tomson)

I proposed this idea last night on the tail-end of another thread and on

10 messages 2002/12/12

[#58913] Inheritance Question — Jim Freeze <jim@...>

Hi

38 messages 2002/12/12
[#58957] Re: Inheritance Question — "Gavin Sinclair" <gsinclair@...> 2002/12/13

From: "Jim Freeze" <jim@freeze.org>

[#58973] Re: Inheritance Question — Jim Freeze <jim@...> 2002/12/13

On Friday, 13 December 2002 at 15:45:27 +0900, Gavin Sinclair wrote:

[#58974] Re: Inheritance Question — ts <decoux@...> 2002/12/13

>>>>> "J" == Jim Freeze <jim@freeze.org> writes:

[#58993] Re: Inheritance Question — ahoward <ahoward@...> 2002/12/13

[#58998] Re: Inheritance Question — ts <decoux@...> 2002/12/13

>>>>> "a" == ahoward <ahoward@fsl.noaa.gov> writes:

[#59002] Re: Inheritance Question — ahoward <ahoward@...> 2002/12/13

On Sat, 14 Dec 2002, ts wrote:

[#59003] Re: Inheritance Question — ts <decoux@...> 2002/12/13

>>>>> "a" == ahoward <ahoward@fsl.noaa.gov> writes:

[#59108] un-extending objects — dblack@...

Hi --

17 messages 2002/12/15

[#59174] Toward ruby-lang.org renewal; trial website offered — matz@... (Yukihiro Matsumoto)

Hi,

33 messages 2002/12/16
[#59202] Re: Toward ruby-lang.org renewal; trial website offered — Trevor.Jenkins@... (Trevor Jenkins) 2002/12/16

On Mon, 16 Dec 2002 14:26:19 +0900, Yukihiro Matsumoto <matz@ruby-lang.org> wrote:

[#59203] Re: Toward ruby-lang.org renewal; trial website offered — Tim Bates <tim@...> 2002/12/16

On Mon, 16 Dec 2002 08:11 pm, Trevor Jenkins wrote:

[#59204] Re: Toward ruby-lang.org renewal; trial website offered — "NAKAMURA, Hiroshi" <nahi@...> 2002/12/16

Hi, all,

[#59343] OT: Functional Language Recommendation — Wai-Sun Chia <waisun.chia@...>

Sorry for the OT post, but I need some advise from some like-minded

23 messages 2002/12/17

[#59392] Re: [OT] RE: help -- persuade my boss to adopt ruby — "Austin Ziegler" <austin@...>

> Ok, I confess: I know nothing about data

10 messages 2002/12/17

[#59508] ANN: FXRuby-1.0.17 Now Available — Lyle Johnson <lyle@...>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----

15 messages 2002/12/18
[#59518] Re: ANN: FXRuby-1.0.17 Now Available — Jim Freeze <jim@...> 2002/12/18

On Thursday, 19 December 2002 at 2:51:08 +0900, Lyle Johnson wrote:

[#59537] Re: ANN: FXRuby-1.0.17 Now Available — Lyle Johnson <lyle@...> 2002/12/18

Jim Freeze wrote:

[#59568] Re: ANN: FXRuby-1.0.17 Now Available — Jim Freeze <jim@...> 2002/12/19

On Thursday, 19 December 2002 at 7:11:59 +0900, Lyle Johnson wrote:

[#59617] Re: ANN: FXRuby-1.0.17 Now Available — Lyle Johnson <lyle@...> 2002/12/19

Jim Freeze wrote:

[#59635] FXRuby and OS X 10.2 (Re: ANN: FXRuby-1.0.17 Now Available) — Brian Wisti <brian@...> 2002/12/19

Hi Lyle,

[#59564] Test::Unit 0.1.5 — <nathaniel@...>

What with all the holiday cheer going around (who can't be cheerful with

24 messages 2002/12/19
[#59621] Re: [ANN] Test::Unit 0.1.5 — Lyle Johnson <lyle@...> 2002/12/19

nathaniel@NOSPAMtalbott.ws wrote:

[#59625] Re: [ANN] Test::Unit 0.1.5 — <nathaniel@...> 2002/12/19

Lyle Johnson [mailto:lyle@users.sourceforge.net] wrote:

[#59808] ANN: FreeRIDE 0.5.0 Release Candidate 1 — "Curt Hibbs" <curt@...>

[drum roll...]

24 messages 2002/12/23

[#59834] ruby-dev summary 19069-19150 — TAKAHASHI Masayoshi <maki@...>

Hello all,

15 messages 2002/12/24

[#59854] ANN: ruby 1.6.8 — matz@... (Yukihiro Matsumoto)

Hello everyone,

16 messages 2002/12/24

[#59954] 1210 / 100 = 12? what? — Tom Sawyer <transami@...>

can someone explain this to me:

35 messages 2002/12/27
[#59955] Re: 1210 / 100 = 12? what? — Gavin Sinclair <gsinclair@...> 2002/12/27

Hello Tom,

[#59957] Re: 1210 / 100 = 12? what? — Tom Sawyer <transami@...> 2002/12/27

no i didn't realize that. i thought ruby would automatically change it to a

[#59962] Re: 1210 / 100 = 12? what? — Brian Wisti <brian@...> 2002/12/27

Hi Tom,

[#59968] Re: 1210 / 100 = 12? what? — Tom Sawyer <transami@...> 2002/12/27

On Thursday 26 December 2002 11:42 pm, Brian Wisti wrote:

[#59984] Re: 1210 / 100 = 12? what? — Philipp Meier <meier@...> 2002/12/27

On Fri, Dec 27, 2002 at 04:10:59PM +0900, Tom Sawyer wrote:

[#59985] Re: 1210 / 100 = 12? what? — Lloyd Zusman <ljz@...> 2002/12/27

Philipp Meier <meier@meisterbohne.de> writes:

[#60006] Ruby & Preprinted forms - will they work together? — colotechpro@... (John Reed)

I'm a Ruby newbie, but I've decided to write a commercial application

18 messages 2002/12/27

[#60016] Installing Fox, FXRuby and fxscintilla — Daniel Carrera <dcarrera@...>

I want to try out FreeRide, but just installing its dependencies has been

22 messages 2002/12/27
[#60018] Re: Installing Fox, FXRuby and fxscintilla — Lyle Johnson <lyle@...> 2002/12/28

Daniel Carrera wrote:

[#60050] RAA suggestions — Gavin Sinclair <gsinclair@...>

1. Reserve "what's new" for genuinely new packages. Introduce a

15 messages 2002/12/28

[#60146] rbbr 0.2rev1 bombs out! — Wai-Sun Chia <waisun.chia@...>

rbbr is looking for a rbbr/config.rb module which is non-existent..

20 messages 2002/12/30
[#60147] Re: rbbr 0.2rev1 bombs out! — Masao Mutoh <mutoh@...> 2002/12/30

Hi,

[#60149] Re: rbbr 0.2rev1 bombs out! — Wai-Sun Chia <waisun.chia@...> 2002/12/30

Huh?

[#60188] Range#size — Martin DeMello <martindemello@...>

I think I missed something - why is Range#size (and all its synonyms)

19 messages 2002/12/30
[#60210] Re: Range#size — matz@... (Yukihiro Matsumoto) 2002/12/31

Hi,

[#60223] Re: Range#size — Gennady Bystritsky <bystr@...> 2002/12/31

From: Gennady F. Bystritsky <gfb@tonesoft.com>

[#60206] Developing a website — "Shashank Date" <sdate@...>

I am planning to use Ruby to develop a website which will be hosted on

17 messages 2002/12/31

[#60217] ENV.clear — zhoujing@... (TOTO)

I tried

15 messages 2002/12/31

[#60221] win32_popen 0.1 — "Park Heesob" <phasis@...>

Hi, all.

15 messages 2002/12/31

Re: help -- persuade my boss to adopt ruby

From: Martin Weber <Ephaeton@...>
Date: 2002-12-11 22:12:20 UTC
List: ruby-talk #58693
On Thu, Dec 12, 2002 at 05:36:12AM +0900, Shannon Fang wrote:
> Hi Ruby Lovers,
> [...]
> [... push ruby instead of java ...]

Heyas.

One problem I really do see if you are competing with a ``smart''
language against java, is that the *SMART* about the language is
actually what is putting it backwards. Face it, Java was designed
for the ``average'' programmer, while ``smart'' languages are
designed to give you the freedom to write ``smart'' programs.

``smart'' programs is in the end what the one who will use the
program will want, on the other hand, your boss will always want
to be able to groom or develop the program even if ``a bus rolls
over you the other day'' or he decides to throw you out.

That is why java often is the language of choice over ``smarter''
languages like one of the ML Family (Ocaml e.g.), Erlang, Haskell,
Lisp or scheme, ruby ...

They can just replace one ``idiot'' programmer with one other ``idiot''
programmer (or even take a good one - java doesn't *force* you to be
average), in the end it's just easier to get someone to program in
java than to get someone who'd be able to do the same (in shorter
time, less LOC, less bugs etc. etc. etc.) in a ``smarter'' language.

What you need to do to boost ruby is not show the ``smart'' functions
of ruby. What you need to do is demonstrate how the code is its own
documentation, how readable the code is, how easy to understand even
complex things are. THEN they will consider ruby. Not if you show them
the ``perl'' strenghts: writing big things in ``just one line''.

When you have code which is shorter than java code, and, without any
documentation at all, will mostly be understood even by managers if
you present a little function or so, not littered by language characteristics,
but by expressive power, then you have a much better chance to promote
Ruby.

Never forget that for a manager, it's not only the technical issues to
decide what language to support for his project. He'll *always* have
the thought "what happens if he leaves us ? Will we be able to easily
find a replacement for him ? will the others of the team fully understand
the application" and stuff like that.

Furthermore you must cultivate a culture of using ruby in your surroundings,
so even if they don't choose ruby now, you can say in a year, hey, ten people
have been using it for a year for ALL KINDS of stuff! And then all will nod.
And it's shorter and easier to read! And then all will nod. And then your
manager will frown, and ask you how to write "ruby".

Hope that helped,

-Martin Weber

In This Thread