[#57185] Cipher book for ruby — Shannon Fang <xrfang@...>

Hi all ruby gurus there,

16 messages 2002/12/01

[#57228] What do some of Ruby's symbols mean? — "Gavin Sinclair" <gsinclair@...>

This could do with some community input before going to the FAQ. The format

31 messages 2002/12/01
[#57234] Re: [FAQ] What do some of Ruby's symbols mean? — dblack@... 2002/12/01

Hi --

[#57237] Re: [FAQ] What do some of Ruby's symbols mean? — Shannon Fang <xrfang@...> 2002/12/01

Hi David

[#57246] [Revised] What do some of Ruby's symbols mean? — "Gavin Sinclair" <gsinclair@...>

Thanks for the instant feedback. And apologies for the offensive late-night

11 messages 2002/12/01

[#57337] Memory consumption problem with recursion — squidster@... (Squidster)

Fellow Rubyists/Rubyians/Rubyans,

10 messages 2002/12/02

[#57349] [Revised again] What are the non-alphanumerical symbols in Ruby code? — "Gavin Sinclair" <gsinclair@...>

Folks,

13 messages 2002/12/02

[#57380] Ruby Book for People Who Aren't (Yet) Programmers — "Chris" <nemo@...>

Hello,

11 messages 2002/12/02

[#57403] Newsgroup — Daniel Carrera <dcarrera@...>

Hello,

28 messages 2002/12/02
[#57409] Re: Newsgroup — "Chris Morris" <chrismo@...> 2002/12/02

In addition, this mailing list is a mirror of the newsgroup, so there's no

[#57411] Re: Newsgroup — Daniel Carrera <dcarrera@...> 2002/12/02

Ruby Book for People Who Aren't (Yet) Programmers

[#57412] Re: Newsgroup — Mauricio Fern疣dez <batsman.geo@...> 2002/12/02

On Tue, Dec 03, 2002 at 04:50:10AM +0900, Daniel Carrera wrote:

[#57438] Re: Newsgroup — Daniel Carrera <dcarrera@...> 2002/12/03

> You might already have received it by now. Get used to receiving the

[#57439] Re: Newsgroup — "Gavin Sinclair" <gsinclair@...> 2002/12/03

[#57440] Re: Ruby Book for People Who Aren't (Yet) Programmers — Daniel Carrera <dcarrera@...> 2002/12/03

> I heard a little while back that there might be a Ruby book in the works for

[#57480] Re: Ruby Book for People Who Aren't (Yet) Programmers — Martin DeMello <martindemello@...> 2002/12/03

Daniel Carrera <dcarrera@math.umd.edu> wrote:

[#57598] Class variables problem — Peter Hickman <peter@...>

I have used

16 messages 2002/12/04

[#57694] Re: Ruby Book for People Who Aren't (Yet) Programmers — "Bill Kelly" <billk@...>

Hi,

13 messages 2002/12/05

[#57735] Re: elseif? — "Shannon Fang" <xrfang@...>

How about a vote? I vote to add elseif as an alternative... Least

20 messages 2002/12/05

[#57816] ratlast 0.1 -- embedded FORTH in Ruby — Mark Probert <probertm@...>

18 messages 2002/12/05

[#57826] Re: elseif? — "Ted" <ted@...>

Yuk! Ruby was presented to me as a 'clean' language.

38 messages 2002/12/05

[#57833] on error resume next — Shannon Fang <xrfang@...>

Hi,

22 messages 2002/12/05

[#57856] Buffered output on Windows — "Chris Pine" <nemo@...>

Quick question:

26 messages 2002/12/05

[#58093] Thank God for backups — Daniel Carrera <dcarrera@...>

I was working on the tutorial just now and wanted to delete all the *~

48 messages 2002/12/07
[#58096] Re: Thank God for backups — "Gavin Sinclair" <gsinclair@...> 2002/12/07

From: "Daniel Carrera" <dcarrera@math.umd.edu>

[#58188] The Ruby Way — Daniel Carrera <dcarrera@...>

What do people think of "The Ruby Way"?

18 messages 2002/12/08

[#58394] Ruby BUG when using PStore and fork — Jeremy Henty <jeremy@...>

PStore does not appear to play well with fork. This script

20 messages 2002/12/09

[#58438] warnings -w — Daniel Carrera <dcarrera@...>

Hello,

20 messages 2002/12/10
[#58439] Re: warnings -w — matz@... (Yukihiro Matsumoto) 2002/12/10

Hi,

[#58441] Re: warnings -w — Daniel Carrera <dcarrera@...> 2002/12/10

> It sets $VERBOSE to true, and gives you extra warnings on parsing.

[#58444] Re: warnings -w — matz@... (Yukihiro Matsumoto) 2002/12/10

[#58446] Re: warnings -w — Daniel Carrera <dcarrera@...> 2002/12/10

> |Thanks. Can you give me an example of a parsing warning that it would

[#58447] Re: warnings -w — matz@... (Yukihiro Matsumoto) 2002/12/10

Hi,

[#58473] Problems transporting nil values using XMLRPC (net/http ?) — Martin Hart <martin@...>

12 messages 2002/12/10

[#58479] Pymacs in ruby? — "Mike Campbell" <michael_s_campbell@...>

This is probably way, way OT, but has anyone considered something along the

15 messages 2002/12/10

[#58597] calling a perl script — max <max@...>

hi

17 messages 2002/12/11

[#58657] functional programming "style" — "zesar" <i_wont@...>

i discovered ruby some weeks ago and i have to say now that i'm through with

13 messages 2002/12/11

[#58662] Re: The coolest thing since sliced bread — "Garriss, Michael" <Michael.Garriss@...>

Ugh! Free write forces users into a new editor? I'm lost without Vim.

21 messages 2002/12/11

[#58677] help -- persuade my boss to adopt ruby — Shannon Fang <xrfang@...>

Hi Ruby Lovers,

18 messages 2002/12/11

[#58689] Re: [ANN] jabber4r 0.3.0 (doesn't work with raa-install) — ptkwt@...1.aracnet.com (Phil Tomson)

15 messages 2002/12/11
[#58751] Re: [ANN] jabber4r 0.3.0 (doesn't work with raa-install) — ptkwt@...1.aracnet.com (Phil Tomson) 2002/12/12

In article <20021211171825.GA2345@localhost.localdomain>,

[#58724] Problem loading extensions in OSX 10.2.2 — Dave Thomas <Dave@...>

12 messages 2002/12/12

[#58730] Re: do I really not understand inheritance?? — "Chris Pine" <nemo@...>

AHA!!!

22 messages 2002/12/12
[#58769] Re: do I really not understand inheritance?? — dblack@... 2002/12/12

Hi --

[#58785] Re: do I really not understand inheritance?? — "Chris Pine" <nemo@...> 2002/12/12

Hmm.... I see what you're saying, I think. I was going to give you a

[#58819] Re: do I really not understand inheritance?? — dblack@... 2002/12/12

Hi --

[#58738] Re: help -- persuade my boss to adopt ruby — "Ted" <ted@...>

Dang! Ugly American idioms...

15 messages 2002/12/12
[#58742] Re: help -- persuade my boss to adopt ruby — "Russ Freeman" <russ@...> 2002/12/12

My advice:

[#58804] Re: help -- persuade my boss to adopt ruby — "Shannon Fang" <xrfang@...>

>it's the MATZ'S position that Ruby will never be REAL WORLD language.

102 messages 2002/12/12
[#59161] Re: help -- persuade my boss to adopt ruby — "Hal E. Fulton" <hal9000@...> 2002/12/16

----- Original Message -----

[#59181] Re: help -- persuade my boss to adopt ruby — "Bulat Ziganshin" <bulatz@...> 2002/12/16

Hello Hal,

[#59295] Re: help -- persuade my boss to adopt ruby — "Rich" <rich@...> 2002/12/17

The problem lies in the fact that these statements are equal:

[#59325] Re: help -- persuade my boss to adopt ruby — Austin Ziegler <austin@...> 2002/12/17

On Tue, 17 Dec 2002 16:49:47 +0900, Rich wrote:

[#59407] Re: help -- persuade my boss to adopt ruby — "Gavin Sinclair" <gsinclair@...> 2002/12/18

From: "Dan Sugalski" <dan@sidhe.org>

[#58870] replace setup.rb/install.rb with builtin module — ptkwt@...1.aracnet.com (Phil Tomson)

I proposed this idea last night on the tail-end of another thread and on

10 messages 2002/12/12

[#58913] Inheritance Question — Jim Freeze <jim@...>

Hi

38 messages 2002/12/12
[#58957] Re: Inheritance Question — "Gavin Sinclair" <gsinclair@...> 2002/12/13

From: "Jim Freeze" <jim@freeze.org>

[#58973] Re: Inheritance Question — Jim Freeze <jim@...> 2002/12/13

On Friday, 13 December 2002 at 15:45:27 +0900, Gavin Sinclair wrote:

[#58974] Re: Inheritance Question — ts <decoux@...> 2002/12/13

>>>>> "J" == Jim Freeze <jim@freeze.org> writes:

[#58993] Re: Inheritance Question — ahoward <ahoward@...> 2002/12/13

[#58998] Re: Inheritance Question — ts <decoux@...> 2002/12/13

>>>>> "a" == ahoward <ahoward@fsl.noaa.gov> writes:

[#59002] Re: Inheritance Question — ahoward <ahoward@...> 2002/12/13

On Sat, 14 Dec 2002, ts wrote:

[#59003] Re: Inheritance Question — ts <decoux@...> 2002/12/13

>>>>> "a" == ahoward <ahoward@fsl.noaa.gov> writes:

[#59108] un-extending objects — dblack@...

Hi --

17 messages 2002/12/15

[#59174] Toward ruby-lang.org renewal; trial website offered — matz@... (Yukihiro Matsumoto)

Hi,

33 messages 2002/12/16
[#59202] Re: Toward ruby-lang.org renewal; trial website offered — Trevor.Jenkins@... (Trevor Jenkins) 2002/12/16

On Mon, 16 Dec 2002 14:26:19 +0900, Yukihiro Matsumoto <matz@ruby-lang.org> wrote:

[#59203] Re: Toward ruby-lang.org renewal; trial website offered — Tim Bates <tim@...> 2002/12/16

On Mon, 16 Dec 2002 08:11 pm, Trevor Jenkins wrote:

[#59204] Re: Toward ruby-lang.org renewal; trial website offered — "NAKAMURA, Hiroshi" <nahi@...> 2002/12/16

Hi, all,

[#59343] OT: Functional Language Recommendation — Wai-Sun Chia <waisun.chia@...>

Sorry for the OT post, but I need some advise from some like-minded

23 messages 2002/12/17

[#59392] Re: [OT] RE: help -- persuade my boss to adopt ruby — "Austin Ziegler" <austin@...>

> Ok, I confess: I know nothing about data

10 messages 2002/12/17

[#59508] ANN: FXRuby-1.0.17 Now Available — Lyle Johnson <lyle@...>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----

15 messages 2002/12/18
[#59518] Re: ANN: FXRuby-1.0.17 Now Available — Jim Freeze <jim@...> 2002/12/18

On Thursday, 19 December 2002 at 2:51:08 +0900, Lyle Johnson wrote:

[#59537] Re: ANN: FXRuby-1.0.17 Now Available — Lyle Johnson <lyle@...> 2002/12/18

Jim Freeze wrote:

[#59568] Re: ANN: FXRuby-1.0.17 Now Available — Jim Freeze <jim@...> 2002/12/19

On Thursday, 19 December 2002 at 7:11:59 +0900, Lyle Johnson wrote:

[#59617] Re: ANN: FXRuby-1.0.17 Now Available — Lyle Johnson <lyle@...> 2002/12/19

Jim Freeze wrote:

[#59635] FXRuby and OS X 10.2 (Re: ANN: FXRuby-1.0.17 Now Available) — Brian Wisti <brian@...> 2002/12/19

Hi Lyle,

[#59564] Test::Unit 0.1.5 — <nathaniel@...>

What with all the holiday cheer going around (who can't be cheerful with

24 messages 2002/12/19
[#59621] Re: [ANN] Test::Unit 0.1.5 — Lyle Johnson <lyle@...> 2002/12/19

nathaniel@NOSPAMtalbott.ws wrote:

[#59625] Re: [ANN] Test::Unit 0.1.5 — <nathaniel@...> 2002/12/19

Lyle Johnson [mailto:lyle@users.sourceforge.net] wrote:

[#59808] ANN: FreeRIDE 0.5.0 Release Candidate 1 — "Curt Hibbs" <curt@...>

[drum roll...]

24 messages 2002/12/23

[#59834] ruby-dev summary 19069-19150 — TAKAHASHI Masayoshi <maki@...>

Hello all,

15 messages 2002/12/24

[#59854] ANN: ruby 1.6.8 — matz@... (Yukihiro Matsumoto)

Hello everyone,

16 messages 2002/12/24

[#59954] 1210 / 100 = 12? what? — Tom Sawyer <transami@...>

can someone explain this to me:

35 messages 2002/12/27
[#59955] Re: 1210 / 100 = 12? what? — Gavin Sinclair <gsinclair@...> 2002/12/27

Hello Tom,

[#59957] Re: 1210 / 100 = 12? what? — Tom Sawyer <transami@...> 2002/12/27

no i didn't realize that. i thought ruby would automatically change it to a

[#59962] Re: 1210 / 100 = 12? what? — Brian Wisti <brian@...> 2002/12/27

Hi Tom,

[#59968] Re: 1210 / 100 = 12? what? — Tom Sawyer <transami@...> 2002/12/27

On Thursday 26 December 2002 11:42 pm, Brian Wisti wrote:

[#59984] Re: 1210 / 100 = 12? what? — Philipp Meier <meier@...> 2002/12/27

On Fri, Dec 27, 2002 at 04:10:59PM +0900, Tom Sawyer wrote:

[#59985] Re: 1210 / 100 = 12? what? — Lloyd Zusman <ljz@...> 2002/12/27

Philipp Meier <meier@meisterbohne.de> writes:

[#60006] Ruby & Preprinted forms - will they work together? — colotechpro@... (John Reed)

I'm a Ruby newbie, but I've decided to write a commercial application

18 messages 2002/12/27

[#60016] Installing Fox, FXRuby and fxscintilla — Daniel Carrera <dcarrera@...>

I want to try out FreeRide, but just installing its dependencies has been

22 messages 2002/12/27
[#60018] Re: Installing Fox, FXRuby and fxscintilla — Lyle Johnson <lyle@...> 2002/12/28

Daniel Carrera wrote:

[#60050] RAA suggestions — Gavin Sinclair <gsinclair@...>

1. Reserve "what's new" for genuinely new packages. Introduce a

15 messages 2002/12/28

[#60146] rbbr 0.2rev1 bombs out! — Wai-Sun Chia <waisun.chia@...>

rbbr is looking for a rbbr/config.rb module which is non-existent..

20 messages 2002/12/30
[#60147] Re: rbbr 0.2rev1 bombs out! — Masao Mutoh <mutoh@...> 2002/12/30

Hi,

[#60149] Re: rbbr 0.2rev1 bombs out! — Wai-Sun Chia <waisun.chia@...> 2002/12/30

Huh?

[#60188] Range#size — Martin DeMello <martindemello@...>

I think I missed something - why is Range#size (and all its synonyms)

19 messages 2002/12/30
[#60210] Re: Range#size — matz@... (Yukihiro Matsumoto) 2002/12/31

Hi,

[#60223] Re: Range#size — Gennady Bystritsky <bystr@...> 2002/12/31

From: Gennady F. Bystritsky <gfb@tonesoft.com>

[#60206] Developing a website — "Shashank Date" <sdate@...>

I am planning to use Ruby to develop a website which will be hosted on

17 messages 2002/12/31

[#60217] ENV.clear — zhoujing@... (TOTO)

I tried

15 messages 2002/12/31

[#60221] win32_popen 0.1 — "Park Heesob" <phasis@...>

Hi, all.

15 messages 2002/12/31

The coolest thing since sliced bread

From: "MikkelFJ" <mikkelfj-anti-spam@...>
Date: 2002-12-11 04:16:29 UTC
List: ruby-talk #58561
The coolest thing since sliced bread is a piece of sandwich bread which is
sliced to 1/3 of the original thickness then polished for crumbs by rotating
the slice on a breadboard. The slice is then cut into small triangles which
are covered by a thin layer of sugar and fried until the sugar becomes
caramel and the triangles curve. Served on home made icecream - that's whats
I learned on telly today anyway.

The other thing I learned today was that humans may genetically have carried
the ability to carve tiny animals out of bone for about 50.000 years before
actually doing so. How about software 50.000 years from now? Grep will
propably work as it ever did. Emacs, no - stop that thought.

I meant to write that FreeRide that is the coolest thing since sliced bread
before getting distracted by broadcast media but now it can only be the
second coolest thing since sliced bread. I was impressed with the Eclipse
plugin design. I was happy that FreeRide was build in Ruby (rather then
being an Eclipse plugin) but chose to follow some of the design principles
of Eclipse. Eclipse is large and bulky in size, yet it is also some of the
best Java GUI around partially due to the SWT GUI and partially due to the
plugin design.

I don't yet know how FreeRide turns out, but I have followed the project on
the sideline peeking at source code, documentation and screenshots.
My expectations are high - I have been following various software
technologies - and also experimented with different principles myself - I
have looked at many technologies. On my shortlist of technologies are Ruby,
Fox, Scintilla, YAML, bidirectional or publish/subscribe based design,
decoupling of GUI from logic, message passing, automated testing, local
responsibility, proper dependency handling (see also SCons build tool). The
key points here is being unbloated, efficient and in control of what is
happening.
I'm not sure about the unit-testing part of FreeRide, but then GUI testing
is non-trivial - but otherwise FreeRide is packed with what I consider great
technologies and principles. It really shows how time spend at doing a
proper initial design pays off - at any rate an IDE this flexible in the
given timeframe and the given manpower is fairly impressive. If only a
number of known operating systems had put as much thought into the core
design, many things would be easier. I'd mention one operating sytem which
seem to have got this right though: QNX. In fact QNX uses message passing in
its tiny core and most services are user processes connected via a namespace
that covers the entire network. QNX scales massively and runs happily across
many machines (it has problems such as security and hard realtime not
necessarily being good for desktops - but there you are). Actually the pipes
of Unix was designed out of a similar vision of plugability, and they
certainly have been useful.

On a conceptual level FreeRide demonstrates some interesting aspects of
software development:
I was never into Ruby because it was all objects - A while back I changed my
view of software as more organic than what can be represented as objects and
class hierachies - after all - what a thing is depends on who looks at the
thing - not the ancestor of the thing. But then I never though Ruby was only
useful for strictly object oriented design. In fact the Array protocol is a
key example - how many collections are derived from Array? They may use
Array and they may even Mix In Array, but they are rarely derived from
Array.

Try pick a UML tool an document the design of FreeRide. Sure you can
describe the each class involved using object and class diagrams. Better yet
you may capture the intialization scenario of some plugin - but how do you
capture the essence of FreeRide?
FreeRide is based on a DataBus where plugins hook up and sence the presence
of other pieces based on patterns of connectivity that lives on the Bus, not
in any single object. It's like Suns mantra: the network is the computer
(they got that right). I really believe this on the path of next generation
software development (even if some of principles are age old) - the DataBus
was designed and implemented, but could have been an integral part of a
software tool as it works at a deeper level than the actual application.
Some of the success of XML related to similar pattern based connectivity
that cannot be formulated in "simple" class relations, at least not in a way
that readily convey the essence of the relationships. Rubys MixIn and Duck
Typing principles also follows these more organic patterns which in turn
originate from Lisp and SmallTalk as I understand.

Now I mentioned the organic aspect - genetically a bird is designed to sit
on a branch of a tree - so why do all birds sit on electrical wires these
days? Its because a bird recognizes a certain feature set as being a branch
useful for sitting for. If these conditions are met, the bird could not care
less whether the branch originates from a tree of the pine-tree family or
not. Which puts us back to duck typing. If it walks like a duck and quacks
like a duck, it is a duck.

As some may have noticed another technology on my shortlist is the
statically type language OCaml - so how does the work in an organic setting?
This langauge basically works on graphs of pieces of data each of which are
statically typed, but they can be recombined in endless ways - we are
essentially short-circuiting the type concept by focusing the types and
basic operations which much like a language grammar allows us to produce
these many combinations which in turn happens to be studied in real life
organisms such as tree growth (L-grammer systems as I recall). Instead of
creating a tree object we a designing branch constructing functions etc.
Thus static typing does not necessarily have anything to do with being
organic or not. A good demonstration of OCamls dynamic nature is the Lexer
module - it's just a record of six or so fields, but some of these fields
are functions that can be completely customized for example reading buffers
by morsecode from the spacebar instead of ASCII from standard input. Lexer
is given to the parser. In a twisted version of the bird analogy, the parser
is the bird and the lexer is the branch. The Ocaml lex/yacc parser is among
the most flexible parsing tools around and still the only type safe parser I
know of. Ruby really needs a Lexer module btw. Thus I'll maintain the claim
that static typing can be organic.

I've recently been "forced" do (D)HTML (it's called work) - and JavaScript
(ECMA / JScript) has many of the same organic aspects of both Ruby and
functional languages - it's dynamically typed and is heavy on closures. You
can do pretty cool stuff in this otherwise fairly limited language.

I see FreeRide as hands on example of how this kind of organic programming
paradigm works. I just hope it does not turn out to be dog slow, bulky and
buggy... In case it is not - it will be an example of dynamic typing versus
the fairly fixed world of Java. It's not quite fair though - there's Java
Messaging and JavaSpaces but who uses that anyway?

Whether you actually send messages as in QNX or you call functions with
context (closures) as in functional programming, or call methods in Ruby or
SmallTalk, the essence is that whatever you call can be dynamically replaced
thus decoupling dependecies and support plugability in ways not to be
predicted just like the birds new favority hangout - the electric wire.
FreeRide provides its own communication model via the DataBus based on this
line organic software principles. Thus - where will FreeRide be 50.000 years
from now?

I'd like to introduce the term Organic Oriented Design & Programming
(OOD/OOP), but I guess it's taken so what about Organic Software Behavior
(OSB). In the end it's not about design or programming, but about how
software interacts with other software and the enviroment.

I have to mention Ant Based Optimization: Ants are dumb, they follow simple
rules that happen to work, or rather, they follow feromone tracks. Turns out
to be an efficient way to solve the rather hard travelling salesman problem.
Keywoard is localized decoupled behaviour with an appropriate sensing input
and output. Giving up global control (such as systematic searching) gives
access to scalability and adaptability. It doesn't quite fit into the
concepts being addressed here, but it is nice to have in mind as the next
thing in software agents communicating over a bus (or over a virtual ant
trails).

I've spend a fair bit of time thinking about and implementing various
aspects of organic software development in my spare time after having seen
the same software being developed over and over again with slightly
different names in yet another collection class.
I'm both embarrassed that FreeRide jumps in and does it fairly simple in
Ruby and thrilled that the concept seems to be workable in practice
(although it's not exactly what I'm looking into). I'd love to be part of
FreeRide but then I'm in over my head with my own projects and work.

I hope FreeRide works out really well and perhaps I may also one day use
FreeRide for developing in other languages - I'm already using Scite for
most development as long as I'm not debugging.



Mikkel



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