From: Corey Jewett <corey@...>
Date: 2005-12-03T09:33:45+09:00
Subject: Re: [OT] Studying in the US

Geez. If our country is so despicably horribly why don't you just  
pack your bags and move to some place more 'enlightened'? Amsterdam  
perhaps? If that's too radical a change for you, maybe try one of the  
many other Western European countries you hold so near and dear.

Or better yet switch to a PoliSci major and make a difference. Until  
then take your meandering diatribe and pipe it to /dev/null next time.

Corey


On Dec 2, 2005, at 4:22 PM, Mike Schwab wrote:

>>
> Congrats on (nearly) finishing your preparations for college.  It's  
> a great time if you do it at all correctly.  While I don't have any  
> experience at universities in other nations, I want to caution you  
> against moving to the US.  Our political screw-ups have a really  
> sad effect on our day-to-day lives.  I'm not just talking about  
> counterproductive drug policies and arrogant torture policy; the  
> hypocrisy goes much deeper than you might realize.  Our cities and  
> towns have been built in a way that favors cars so strongly that  
> bikes are an uncommon sight in many communities, and drivers lose  
> touch with their peers because they are always behind a thick layer  
> of steel and glass.  This in turn makes it quite dangerous to ride  
> bikes in such communities, because drivers aren't aware that you  
> might be on the road as well.  So parents forbid their children  
> from biking; social isolation mounts among those who are too young  
> to drive or too frugal to own a car; the economy fails to provide  
> any entertainment for those under 21 because they aren't mobile  
> enough to be profitable; and the only diversions kids show interest  
> in are alcohol and pot.  But these substances are forbidden and  
> users persecuted, which doesn't reduce consumption but forces it  
> into unsupervised situations, where it becomes all the more  
> dangerous (especially because of the copious driving involved in  
> this constant cover-up).
>
> College life is a wonderful escape compared to growing up in the  
> suburbs, especially if you're at a school like mine that recognizes  
> that alcohol is a health issue and not a disciplinary issue (sadly  
> I don't know of any other US schools that have such an enlightened  
> policy).  Still, the culture of substance abuse persists; and our  
> national obsession with big-box sporting events also has a crappy  
> effect because it drastically increases social segregation on  
> campus (and essentially steals the lives, and destroys the  
> cartilage, of those who are talented enough to be recruited).   
> Great teachers are far between, as are students who unabashedly  
> show an insatiable interest in anything.  Schools in other nations  
> may not have the same social unity, but at least people know why  
> they are there (to learn) and they value that opportunity pretty  
> highly.
>
> Now, I know that people abuse substances the world over, but I am  
> certain that the patterns of use in most places are not so  
> pointless and boring as they tend to be here.  Go somewhere (like  
> Canada) that has a drinking age of 19 or lower; you'll find  
> yourself in a much nicer environment.  Personally, I am hoping to  
> get myself to your part of the world by any means possible... I  
> understand your regard for US schools, but I again caution you  
> against leaving the warm embrace of social democracy.
>
> California is a bit of a different story.  Failing Europe or Canada  
> that's probably where I'll end up, so if you make it there let me  
> know!
>
> -Mike
>
>> And by then you'll be of legal drinking age in the US as well.
>>
>> Finally, I'll let my own nationalism slip through, and suggest  
>> that you think about Canada as well as the US.  The University of  
>> Toronto is a good school for CS and math, and is a great city.   
>> Simon Frasier University near Vancouver is smaller, but has a good  
>> reputation as well, and both Vancouver and Toronto are fantastic  
>> cities to live in.  Canadian universities also generally cheaper  
>> than the US, even when paying international tuition rates.
>
>