From: "austin (Austin Ziegler) via ruby-core" Date: 2023-05-22T17:40:53+00:00 Subject: [ruby-core:113597] [Ruby master Feature#19682] ability to get a reference to the "default definee" Issue #19682 has been updated by austin (Austin Ziegler). bughit (bug hit) wrote in #note-17: > austin (Austin Ziegler) wrote in #note-16: > > bughit (bug hit) wrote in #note-15: > > > If this feature request is to be rejected, it should be with the full awareness of what "default definee" is and why it matters to the user. Not with ignorant misconceptions. > > > > Could you ELI5 what a "default definee" is, why it would be useful, and perhaps give examples of how it would be used? > > The explanation of "default definee" is in the blog article linked in the OP, which you have not read for some reason, despite wanting to discuss it. I���ve read the article. It seems interesting but not useful. How would having easy access to the default definee help me write better Ruby meta programming? If you���re convinced that this is such a good idea, you should be able to demonstrate a use case trivially. As you���ve been asked to do multiple times. > > I���ve been using Ruby for 21 years and done lots of metaprogramming and ��� I have absolutely no clue what you���re talking about in this ticket. > > You almost seem to be saying that with pride. Well ok, congrats on that. No. I���m just saying that you seem to think that you know better than people who have been implementing Rubies for a very long time and people who have done a lot of work with Ruby���and won���t come up with a simple example of how access to this implementation detail (I���m not sure that any version of Ruby except MRI would need to implement things this way) would make it easier to solve real problems. This, and your immediate combativeness across multiple tickets, is what has caused the current issue to spiral. For what it���s worth, starting a ticket with a link isn���t necessarily the best way to convince people. I think that you could have gotten better traction with something like: > In 2009, Yugui described the difference between self and the ���default definee��� https://blog.yugui.jp/entry/846. This context seems pretty important, so why not make it easy to identify? Then you could have gone into what benefit access to that context would provide so that the suggestion could be measured on the merit of benefit, even if that benefit is better specifying behaviour for future Ruby implementations. Not hard, not combative. Frankly, the blog post didn���t even register because I read these through the mailing list and it is right below some Redmine ticket cruft. If you do happen to be smarter than everyone else, try assuming that you need to help people understand, rather than assuming that they���re too stupid to possible ever understand. You���ll get more accomplished. ---------------------------------------- Feature #19682: ability to get a reference to the "default definee" https://bugs.ruby-lang.org/issues/19682#change-103236 * Author: bughit (bug hit) * Status: Open * Priority: Normal ---------------------------------------- https://blog.yugui.jp/entry/846 "default definee" is a pretty important context so why not make it easy to identify? Could be a Module class method or a global method (Kernel) or a keyword. -- https://bugs.ruby-lang.org/ ______________________________________________ ruby-core mailing list -- ruby-core@ml.ruby-lang.org To unsubscribe send an email to ruby-core-leave@ml.ruby-lang.org ruby-core info -- https://ml.ruby-lang.org/mailman3/postorius/lists/ruby-core.ml.ruby-lang.org/